fuel issue??

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:26 am

Ethanol in gasoline has nothing to do with gasoline evaporating and leaving deposits that clog a fuel system when it sits for years. That's what gasoline does. You can throw any additive in there that your heart desires, but you can't stop evaporation and collection of solids unless the system is sealed. Boat fuel systems are not sealed.

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

Which stations on the way to the lakes sell ethanol free fuel? I may have to start giving them business.
Glad you got it figured out.
I had a '95 KLX650 that if I went more than one week between riding it, and forgot to cut off the fuel supply before parking it in my garage, would not start when getting back to it until I drain the float bowl of the ethanol-laced fuel that sat in it for a week. Luckily it only took 30 seconds to drain it, but it was still a testament to the ridiculous problems that the gubment has caused mandating ethanol in our fuel. It's almost as if that law was made by a bunch of lawyers who are, by their very nature, stupid when it comes to the real world.

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:08 am

Wouldn't start after a week of sitting? Yeah it wasn't the fuel's problem. It's really easy to blame the unknown on just bad maintenance.

204Angler · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:16 am

ric wrote:

Ethanol in gasoline has nothing to do with gasoline evaporating and leaving deposits that clog a fuel system when it sits for years. That's what gasoline does. You can throw any additive in there that your heart desires, but you can't stop evaporation and collection of solids unless the system is sealed. Boat fuel systems are not sealed.

You're right, gasoline does that by it's very nature however, you can't deny that ethanol has caused more fuel issues and cost consumers more money in fixing and modifying for ethanol, than gasoline ever did on its own.

204Angler · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:21 am

kd4pbs wrote:

Which stations on the way to the lakes sell ethanol free fuel? I may have to start giving them business.
Glad you got it figured out.
I had a '95 KLX650 that if I went more than one week between riding it, and forgot to cut off the fuel supply before parking it in my garage, would not start when getting back to it until I drain the float bowl of the ethanol-laced fuel that sat in it for a week. Luckily it only took 30 seconds to drain it, but it was still a testament to the ridiculous problems that the gubment has caused mandating ethanol in our fuel. It's almost as if that law was made by a bunch of lawyers who are, by their very nature, stupid when it comes to the real world.

It is that little gas station/bait shop on 42/Avent Ferry, used to be called Mark's bait and tackle now it is Tri-River or something. It is costly of course but it is where I try to always gas up my boats.
I get deployed alot and always "winterize" it regardless of time of year because I know my wife doesn't always have the time to run it once a week so usually have no problems coming back from those trips. I have been TDY alot too and one time I was only going to be gone for 9 days, ended up being two weeks...came back, bike would turn over and want to start but it didn't. Fuel injected bike. (2008 Boulevard). Took to a shop and they say it was the ethanol. They charged me one hour of labor and 1 gal. of fresh 93 octane, started right up

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:30 am

204Angler wrote:

ric wrote:

Ethanol in gasoline has nothing to do with gasoline evaporating and leaving deposits that clog a fuel system when it sits for years. That's what gasoline does. You can throw any additive in there that your heart desires, but you can't stop evaporation and collection of solids unless the system is sealed. Boat fuel systems are not sealed.

You're right, gasoline does that by it's very nature however, you can't deny that ethanol has caused more fuel issues and cost consumers more money in fixing and modifying for ethanol, than gasoline ever did on its own.

It hasn't. Ethanol based fuels are a natural detergent, they keep the fuel system clean. Non-ethanol based fuel creates a varnish layer quite fast. The issue arises when a non-ethanol boat with crap tons of varnish in the fuel tank fills up with E10. The E10 cleans out the varnish and gums of the fuel system with all the crap.

There's nothing wrong with ethanol based fuels.

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

ric wrote:

Wouldn't start after a week of sitting? Yeah it wasn't the fuel's problem. It's really easy to blame the unknown on just bad maintenance.

You prove every day that you are an uninformed dumbshit, Ric.
Yes, it is the fuel. Friend has identical bike, right down to the same color scheme. He has the exact same issue. We once filled up at the non-ethanol pump to use as an experiment. Guess what? No issues after 3 weeks.
Do you even know what a KLX650 is, and why it is particularly sensitive to ethanolated fuel sitting in the carb? I didn't think so.

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:11 am

kd4pbs wrote:

ric wrote:

Wouldn't start after a week of sitting? Yeah it wasn't the fuel's problem. It's really easy to blame the unknown on just bad maintenance.

You prove every day that you are an uninformed dumbshit, Ric.
Yes, it is the fuel. Friend has identical bike, right down to the same color scheme. He has the exact same issue. We once filled up at the non-ethanol pump to use as an experiment. Guess what? No issues after 3 weeks.
Do you even know what a KLX650 is, and why it is particularly sensitive to ethanolated fuel sitting in the carb? I didn't think so.

I owned a 91 Suzuki RGV250 for many years running on E10. Not one single problem and that's way more sensitive than your KLX650. It would sit for weeks and fire right up and run perfect.

Sorry, but E10 sitting in your carb bowl for a week wasn't the issue. E10 doesn't phase separate in a week of sitting still. Takes about 3 months.

Capt. Hoss · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:17 am

ric wrote:

kd4pbs wrote:

ric wrote:

Wouldn't start after a week of sitting? Yeah it wasn't the fuel's problem. It's really easy to blame the unknown on just bad maintenance.

You prove every day that you are an uninformed dumbshit, Ric.
Yes, it is the fuel. Friend has identical bike, right down to the same color scheme. He has the exact same issue. We once filled up at the non-ethanol pump to use as an experiment. Guess what? No issues after 3 weeks.
Do you even know what a KLX650 is, and why it is particularly sensitive to ethanolated fuel sitting in the carb? I didn't think so.

I owned a 91 Suzuki RGV250 for many years running on E10. Not one single problem and that's way more sensitive than your KLX650. It would sit for weeks and fire right up and run perfect.

Sorry, but E10 sitting in your carb bowl for a week wasn't the issue. E10 doesn't phase separate in a week of sitting still. Takes about 3 months.

So E10 doesn't start getting water in it after a week of sitting making it a hard to start issue? wonder how long the fuel has set in a holding tank at the station? But I guess poor maintaince is always the answer to your issues.

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:26 am

Capt. Hoss wrote:

So E10 doesn't start getting water in it after a week of sitting making it a hard to start issue? wonder how long the fuel has set in a holding tank at the station? But I guess poor maintenance is always the answer to your issues.

I don't see any epidemics of cars not starting after sitting for a week, do you? Poor maintenance is always the issue. You've been around the boat scene long enough to know that NOBODY ever takes care of their stuff.

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

ric wrote:

Sorry, but E10 sitting in your carb bowl for a week wasn't the issue. E10 doesn't phase separate in a week of sitting still. Takes about 3 months.

My hat's off to you, Ric. You pegged the issue 100%. Every single KLX650 owner in the world who has to deal with ethanolated fuel is 100% wrong, and their similar experiences with hard starting a large, single cylinder engine after sitting for as little as a week in humid climates that is 100% exactly like your small single cylinder engine in all ways, shapes and forms owe you a debt of gratitude in finding that the issue is actually maintenance related and not because of the fuel they use absorbing atmospheric moisture increasing the flash point of the fuel, causing problems from an already lean factory carburetor setup. :roll:

I guess the fact that all of us that changed from the factory selected pilot and main jets to a richer set found that it greatly reduced the "week-old-fuel-hard-start" issue figured it all wrong, and actually ended up inadvertently fixing some strange maintenance issue.
I sit corrected, and once again bow to your superior knowledge and intellect over we mere morons.

Almost forgot...
I guess it was poor maintenance that caused all of us poor KLX650 morons to notice that the gasoline that poured on the concrete from draining the float bowl wouldn't even ignite when a match or lighter was held to it. I guess it was also miraculous Leprechauns that would come to our bikes in the middle of the night and temporarily fix our engines whenever we remembered to let the fuel run out of the carburetor by turning off the petcock before parking the bike.

deafwish · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:42 pm

Alcohol based fuels (E90, E85 etc) are hygroscopic, like brake fluids.
Humid environments accelerate this & frequently cause IC engines grief!

www.iFourWinns.com

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