www.iFourWinns.com

1995 Redline 351 H190 jet propulsion, little hard starting after it sets for a little while..... 'Little while" is typically 15 minutes or longer.

This, sorta, has just started 2 weeks ago. Boat would always fire right up if it was 'cold' and has always been somewhat ornery when it's warmed (145 degrees). Cold, turn the key and bam, she's running smooth and throttles perfectly. Once it was warmed, cranking on it for quite some time was the norm. I finally figured out a spritz of starting fluid and it would always fire up immediately. Well two weeks ago this has progressed to difficult starting all the time if the boat sets for a little while (again, random time, maybe 15 minutes or more). If the boats running, shut it off, wait just a minute or two and she'll fire up.

Carb 4bbl has fresh rebuild, new plugs and wires, set timing and I've burnt 2+ tanks of fuel thru the boat this spring running 91 octane so I know it's fresh fuel. When the boats running it's perfect running in every way, idle is perfect, idle to WOT there's not a single hesitation and will turn 5.5k on the tach. Running WOT it will settle back in around 4700 RPM and cruise as long as you want at WOT without an issue. WOT closed to idle is perfect, motor drops to ~800 RPM and idles like a dream.

This starting issue is beginning to wear me a little thin. Anyone got any input? My thought was maybe a fuel pump or filter, I have not changed either but while running, especially WOT for extended periods, I would expect something awry if it were either of those two items.

Open to ideas. I did have a mechanic tell me if the motor is worn with low compression it could cause this issue, I did a compression test and every cylinder was ~115 psi. She just runs too good for me to think she's worn out.

Vapor lock?

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

I had a Ford 302 with an Autolite 2100 carb way back in the late 70s. In hot weather, you would get what was either vapor lock or fuel bubbling in the carb because of the heat rising off the water heated intake manifold. Probably got hotter than a comparable GM manifold. Anyway I heard that the way to fix this was to use a carb insulator under the carb gasket, to move the carb bowl away from the intake manifold's heat. I never wound up doing that but I put silver wrap pipe insulation on the steel fuel line and that seemed to help. When it does not start try taking off the flame arrestor and pump the throttle, see if you can see fuel being squirted out. Also open the throttle all the way and see if any fuel is dripping out of the booster venturis. Is this a marine Holley carb? I had the fuel dripping issue when running at idle with my Quadrajet and had to re-set the fuel mixture to get it to stop.

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88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

Are you priming the engine (pump the throttle a couple times) prior to startup?
Is your Accelerator Pump working correctly?
Insulated carb base pads can work on a car, but you're going to get heat soak in an enclosed bilge no matter what you do!

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2011 Four Winns H180 SS.
Aussie built Mustang 2800.
SOLD - 1997 Four Winns Horizon RS

Out on the water today, sucked a tow rope into the jet grate (because I hate to shut it off due to the hard starting). Still hard starting..... Yep, I can visually confirm when pumping the throttle there's a stream of fuel being injected as expected. I can confirm the electric choke is properly working. Yes it's the Holley Marine 4160 carb.

I have noticed the last time out the bottom front side of the carb was wet with fuel. I pulled the carb off this morning and snugged up all bolts/screws. While there wasn't anything obvious loose, I didn't feel they were tight enough. Snugging up all the bolts/screws took care of the fuel weeping issues on the front of the carb.

I'm so baffled with this starting issue. I'm not a mechanic but I have turned a few wrenches in my younger years. As an IT guy by trade, I'm proud of the fact I am good at tracing down odd things but this just makes no sense to me. Crank and crank it won't fire, a spritz of starting fluid and it'll fire immediately and run like a champ. One can only assume it's been this way for some time as when I purchased the boat there were 3 cans of starting fluid tucked in various locations. I hate to buy a new carb just on a hunch. The carb rebuild took care of crappy idle and lethargic/stumbling hole shots.

I'm leaning towards if I have to buy a new $600 carb, I'm converting to fuel injection but with a $6500 boat, adding a $1500 fuel injection conversion kit just doesn't make much sense.

Coil?

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

Replaced a couple months ago with plugs and wires - it's a standard NAPA - same model number that was in the boat - original one looked fairly new. It is positioned horizontal and I have read some folks having issues with horizontal mounted coils causing hot starting issues.....

I'd entertain an upgraded or different coil option if someone has a suggestion.

I don't, but whenever I hear about an engine having trouble after warmup I suspect the coil. Those things can cause so many headaches since even a failed one usually works fine until it gets hot. Is there any way to find out whether the one you're using is oil filled or epoxy filled? NAPA may be able to tell you.

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

If it fires with starting fluid, it's clearly a fuel issue.
Maybe your idle circuit is blocked with crud? Tried in-tank injector/ carby cleaner through your tank?
Next time, try start it with 1/4 throttle (in neutral of course) & see if she fires up.

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2011 Four Winns H180 SS.
Aussie built Mustang 2800.
SOLD - 1997 Four Winns Horizon RS

Open the engine hatch and run the blower continually to cool off the engine compartment to check for vapor lock/hot fuel issues.

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Terry
Current: 07 Crownline 255 CCR cuddy - 350 Mag MPI/B3 "Casi Cielo"

Previous:97 245 Sundowner 5.7GI/SX

Tow vehicle: 1986 GMC 2500 Camper Special 454/TH400

If the idle circuit is too lean, it would make sense that it would run better when the choke is still on. Try re-adjusting the idle mixture and set it toward the rich side.

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88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

My 5.0 EFI acts the exact same way after trying to restart when sitting for a bit after being hot. I've tried several things except the coil, may have to give this a shot.

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2008 H200 Frenzy Edition 5.0 GXi

1993 Horizon 190 5.0 EFI (Sold)

I'm sure it's oil filled. Thinking about buying epoxy filled just to rule out that.... I hate throwing parts at it but doing nothing isn't helping .

I have run Seafoam thru the tank as well as carb cleaner, etc. I can't start the boat in anything but neutral, at least anytime I try anything position other than dead neutral I get no cranking. I thought I should be able to push the throttle center button and go to a standard fast idle throttle position but when I set that no cranking.

That is odd, it really should allow you to crank the engine with the button pushed in (mine is an original OMC control on those you pull the handle out to disengage the shift system). It must not be releasing the shift system position and the neutral safety switch won't allow it to crank. For sure that would make any carbed engine harder to start.

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88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

Grrrr.... Now you jabbed me wondering.... Boat is stored in a heated garage about a mile away from me, you're gonna make me get out and go tinker/test the fast idle. Lol.

Must fight the urge, it's late and a couple crown and cokes tonight, I better stay home. On the way to work in the morning tho, I'll have to stop and spend a few minutes testing the fast idle throttle positions...