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Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
https://www.smwebhead.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=15524		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  jontmiller [ Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:56 am ]
Post subject:  Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
about 5 hours on the boat since installing her in the water, just cruising runs around the lake to get stabilized gas used up and work out any kinks. Filled it up with fresh gas from lake marina and put it away for the day Friday, took it out Sunday for the first real workout. (tubing, cruising, idling)

When hot, after pulling run it will run on (diesel) a bit....turn key back on for 30 seconds then off and it usually shuts off fine. Launching with a load can hear some pinging. Then a few hours later after totally cooled off boat would start but required higher than usual revs (1500 or so) for a few minutes otherwise it would stall as soon as put into gear.

I think I know the answers.....general tune up / timing check required. 5th season with the boat, all symptoms have happened occasionally in the past just seemed a bit more problematic yesterday. I have not touched the engine besides winterization/oil changes.

I am assuming plugs / timing the largest culprit, and maybe the mixture is a bit off but what comes first, prefer not to pull it out of the water either but suspect I will have to.

Any opinions welcome as usual. (check sig line, 98 H200, 4.3 Volvo (carbed, gm vortec engine)
Author:  230 Mike [ Mon Jun 12, 2017 8:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Start with timing IMO.
Author:  babbot1 [ Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Sounds like its running rich to me. Tune up can't hurt but probably need a carb clean and tune.
Author:  LouC [ Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Pinging and dieseling is usually a sign of:
lean fuel mixture
over-advanced timing
carbon build up in the cyl heads and on top of pistons
fuel octane too low.
idle speed to high, or throttle cable not allowing it to return to idle

Easy solution is to check timing, make sure its not too advanced and use premium gas.
If that does not do the trick, you may need to either adjust the idle mixture or clean the carb due to dirt clogging jets which leans out the mixture.

I have always used premium gas in my 4.3 and it never pinged or dieseled ever.

If the simple fix does not work do not keep running it because pinging in a marine engine will cause burned valves low compression and you'll have to re-do the cyl heads sooner or later.
Author:  jontmiller [ Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Thanks all, I am aware of most engine maladies at least through the eyes of aviation engines...just not much real world automotive marine stuff and haven't adjusted the timing on an engine since a 1979 VW Sirocco. But do have access to a timing light. In my minds eye there is a hot spot in the cylinders causing the pre-ignition. I do run carb cleaner through before and after winterization.

The boat has dieseled like this on and off a bit over the years. Were not allowed to self fuel where I keep the boat and although I don't know what octane the marina fuel is I'm sure its not premium....may have to look into an octane booster.

to add a wrinkle this morning the damn thing didn't start, caught once stalled and then just turned over. I may have flooded it and will look at it a bit tomorrow. Only thing that changed was getting fuel on Friday, he mentioned they just got a delivery of 4000 gallons and I wonder what he meant by 'just got' as I know those deliveries stir up a lot of water for an hour or so...just seems too coincidental.
Author:  LouC [ Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Might want to first verify proper choke function for cold starts and then dump out the fuel filter into a mason jar and see if there is water and/or sediment in the bottom of the jar.
Author:  jontmiller [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Well, as embarrassingly bad as these look I will post pics so hopefully others can learn. : )

ImageUntitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr

ImageUntitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr

url=https://flic.kr/p/VaJVKU]Image[/url]Untitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr

ImageUntitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr

So yea, I haven't looked at these since I picked up the boat....no idea on hours or age....last pic is the coil lead...it was very corroded.


Soooo will be ordering new ignition parts. Anything else I should be looking at that I may have screwed up letting it get this bad in the first place? Anyone done the plugs without removing seat hardware? (sunpad rear setup) looks like a pain to reach the back ones so I suspect I will just take boat out of the water and do it right.

<<sigh>>
Author:  BrentC5Z [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Do you have a water/fuel separator? I never count on marina gas being good. Based on the first post, it ran OK with the old stabilized fuel.
Author:  jontmiller [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
yea I do have a separator but forgot the filter wrench when heading down today....the fact that it ran well until filling with gas does bother me a bit as well....but that distributor cap looks pretty awful as well.
Author:  jontmiller [ Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
just got the boat home and pulled the filter/separator and everything came out clean and fuel like.....seaming more and more like an ignition problem
Author:  zims1993 [ Wed Jun 14, 2017 2:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
With that much corrosion this could be your culprit, a good regular tune up is in order. I would also replace plug wires if your doing all this also.
Author:  jontmiller [ Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Still waiting for parts, but pulled the plugs today and they look a bit better than I expected.....and I got the recently done-with-school teenager to turn a wrench rather than a press a button for a little while today as well.


ImageUntitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr


ImageUntitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr

ImageUntitled by Jon Miller, on Flickr
Author:  TX H210SS [ Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Nice job...especially getting the kiddo involved. them youngsters bend so much better than us. heal faster too! I got one in college and just gave him the bass tracker fishgetter.....with the provision that he research how to change the impeller and change it out on his own. We shall see how that project goes.
Author:  Bliss36 [ Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
Couldnt help but notice the insulator looks considerably different on cyl#4 than all the other cylinders. Might be worth doing a compression test since the plugs are out just to rule out any potential issues there
Author:  jontmiller [ Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dieseling / pinging / general bleh motor
interrupted by vacation....but was able to turn some wrenches on the old girl today,

after replacing most ignition components EXCEPT the coil (cap, wires, rotor, plugs) it still wouldn't fire, tested the coil per the mx manual and it failed the test so replaced with part from local NAPA store and now it runs great (on muffs)

I didn't take any photos but the new coil has a different bracket than the old one, I ended up having to grind off the rivets on the new and old one to use the old bracket on the new coil.

will take it out tomorrow to verify everything...if its happy plan on watching the amateur fireworks on the lake tomorrow evening.

Big thanks to all the help and opinions on here....it really is nice having this community to bounce issues off of .

Have a safe and happy 4th of July
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