Going from a 6.5 to 6X9 speaker?

usje141 · **Joined:** Sat Apr 24, 2010 9:22 am **Posts:** 78

I've got a Horizon 190 with two Clarion 6.5" speakers mounted under each helm that I'm going to replace. The natural choice (on this board anyway) seems to generally be the Polk DB651's but I'm thinking of going with some 6X9's.

That said, it seems like very few go with a bigger speaker like that. Is it because most speaker locations are too small to handle a 6X9, or is there some other reason(s) at work here? Because these two speakers are mounted on plywood covered with carpet, I think I should be able to easily enlarge the current 5" holes to accommodate a 6X9.

I've got my eye on some Infinity 6912M's which have great range and sensitivity. I currently have the stock Clarion head, a Kenwood 40 RMS X 4 amp and two Alpine 6.5's in the bow.

Thoughts?

Toddely · **Posted:** Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:12 pm

I have a horizon 180 and I just updated the system. I installed a kenwood head unit and two sets of the Polk db651 speakers. Front in the bow and back in the side panels. It totally rocks, clear, clean quality sound. I myself don't think I need it to be any louder.. My old speakers were 6.5" speakers so changing them was simple. Hope this helps.

deafwish · **Posted:** Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:16 pm

No problems in using 6x9's.
If well baffled/ boxed, you'll get incredible mid-bass out of them, with 40WRMS!

Host some pic's of the finished project, when you're done...

ric · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:40 am

You're not going to get bass out of 2 way speakers. You want bass? Install a subwoofer. That being said, a good quality 6.5 round will work just as well as a 6x9. Polk DB651's with a small class D amp sound amazing. My last boat had two DB651's and a DB1040 sub. It rocked the house!!

This is all you need to make the DB's sound perfect (if you have a decent head unit!!)
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_719 ... C1410.html

My current boat has 4 Infinity 612m's and they're getting replaced. Too bright.

Toddely · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:50 am

If I would add a small amp to my new system, would it make a big difference? If so in what ways. ? Sorry not trying to hack your post.

Jdpber · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:01 am

PLEASE for the love of god do not get 6x9.. oval has horrible sound quality SQ replication.. stick with round 6.5 speakers. as RIC said you will not see the bass.. If you want a jam up stereo and only want 2 speakers i would get the MM651um speakers they are simply CLEAN... and a 8-10" marine bazooka if you do not want to cut a huge sub hole in a compartment. the marine bazookas are a great Sub to deliver some bass to your ears..

ANOTHER huge reason to not do 6x9s is that size is greatly limited in future choices once the hole is cut..

VOTE NO TO 6x9

ric · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:04 am

Yes, you will always see an increase in sound quality running the correct wattage to your speakers. Speakers that are underdriven (not enough power) sound really really horrible when turned up loud. Polk DB651's sound like a whole new speaker at around 50w each compared to just a standard head unit that's giving it 8w.

Toddely · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:34 am

sweet, I will have to look into that amp then. Thanks for the info.

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

I'd put 6" x 9" speakers over 6.5" rounds in a heartbeat. The larger cone area lends itself to better low frequency sensitivity. If you'd like "deeper" bass, then it would be a cinch.
A friend summed it up exquisitely...
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/car-audio-truth-myths-industry-dogma/103078-myth-oval-odd-shaped-speakers-cant-sound-good-round-speakers.html

When I was heavy into IASCA competitons in the late 80's, very few people knew how to make a decent sounding automotive system (or boat systems). Higher end autosound components were extremely high-priced, hard to find, and our choices were limited. None of us would have ever dreamed of trying to make a 5" speaker reproduce anything below 200Hz. We'd usually tweak the active crossovers to sharply roll off at ~160Hz on 6.5" speakers. Decent 6" x 9" speakers could be relied upon for frequencies down to 100Hz, and since most cars back then had 6" x 9" cutouts on the rear shelf, it was a no-brainer. Physical limitations of a smaller cone make them inherently incapable of reproducing bass as efficiently as a larger cone, just as a larger cone is inherently incapable of reproducing high frequencies as compared to a smaller cone. One doesn't try to make a 5" speaker work as a tweeter for a reason.
Sound quality was an important factor that the judges looked at. I never heard one of them comment that 6" x 9" speakers were somehow inferior. Quite the contrary in fact; the extended reach into the lower frequencies helped complement large subwoofer systems that tended to be too "peaky" in the double-digit frequency range. They'd fill in the gap between subwoofer and midrange quite handily, and their scores in the sound quality aspect of the competitions tended to reflect that fact.

Toddely · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:38 am

Ohh boy.

Jdpber · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:50 am

YOU ARE STILL NOT going to get true BASS out of a 6x9 that is mid bass.. and in a boat that will be lost.. in a sealed air space like a car you can contain the mid bass produced from a 6x9 or a 6.5 but in a boat it is simply lost. you must have a true SUBWOOFER to have deep bass in an open air space like a boat.. if you look at any out door concert that can truly jam (i have been to over 200 concerts mow) and the good sound stages always have 3-4:1 subs vs horns.. this is because the low frequencies do not travel the same as the highs..

If you think because he was tuned for a 6x9 for a car that he got "BASS" you are mistaken.. yes you can get in that range but it will not be the bass that i think you are after..

Your best bet is to toss an amp not he speakers you currently have.. Listen to that first and then take the next step. As i am willing to bet once you make the jump from <10w to 50+ per channel you will be very surprised at how much pep an amp can put in those existing speakers.. then you need to address the bass separately from the speakers and install a SUBWOOFER..

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

Sorry - that may have been too many words I guess. :cry:

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

Agreed 100%. For reproducing bass (not sure the difference between "true" and "false" bass) one needs power. An exponentially larger amount of power, technically speaking. And large speakers. So, the answer is to install some 30' tall concert sub stacks. :roll:

If, however, you don't have room for a subwoofer, and realize you will be compromising, then a 6" x 9" speaker will deliver better low frequency response than a 6.5" speaker. Again, it's a matter of physics.

Jdpber · **Posted:** Tue Jul 29, 2014 11:05 am

I never said that they were inferior.. Mainly his current speakers will work if he delivers more power to them.. but i feel he wants bass not mid bass and you cannot get true bass from a 6x9.. i had 3 way Memphis 6x9s in my old buick and they made alright SQ reflecting off of the rear glass but the bass came from the 2 carbon comp 12s int he trunk.

The same has to be said that you can not take the sharp ting out of a titanium tweeter and make it sound softer like a silk dome tweeter the speakers are different.

This said i feel he is after some LOW end and that will only happen with a true driver. A true audiophile will know that a round speaker makes a more even wave reproduction than an oval or by god if i see another square kicker uuuhhh..

THIS IS NOT MENT TO BE A DEBATE OR ARGUMENT AT ALL.. we are here to share information.. i have over 15 years in the car stereo installation field and hands down will promote a round speaker any time that i can. Especially since his cutouts are already 6.5. Their are vastly more options for a 6.5 than a 6x9.

AS above post.. yes the physics is a larger surface space but it will be marginal as your drivers are (for comparison) the same so the produced bass will not be noticed by the ear in an open air space..

ANOTHER key element to remember if they are not at least a 2 way 6x9 you will not be able to reproduce a full frequency range as you would with a true separate 3 way system of individual speakers..

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

Not arguing. Just went over the thread with a fine toothed comb though and never saw where the OP stated he wanted as much bass reproduction as possible. He simply queried for thoughts on replacing 6.5" with 6" x 9" speakers, which I added to.
As far as oddly shaped speakers lending to inferior sound quality, I guess you've never heard of Apogee Acoustic's "Grand".

www.iFourWinns.com

Going from a 6.5 to 6X9 speaker?

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