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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:50 pm 
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Clownfish
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Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:54 pm
Posts: 45
Location: Union Township, Pa.
I have a 1997 5.7GLi. For the past 4-5 years when I winterize the engine, I disconnect a half inch hose fitting located just below the port side head on the engine block. When removed, water and particles of black rust immediately come out of the engine block and hose. Most of it looks like coffee grounds, but when I insert a screw driver or wire into the fitting or hose, larger pieces (1/4") come out. I collect it out of the bilge with a magnet and the amount would fill a shot glass half full.
The boat is primarily used in the fresh waters of the upper Chesapeake Bay. I winterize the engine with
-50 degree RV antifreeze.

Any idea what might be going on? Risers? I haven't noticed any temperature problems...yet.

Any thoughts/ info is appreciated!
Thanks!

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1997 23.8 Four Winns Vista
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:39 pm 
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Shark

Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:32 pm
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I get a bit everytime I fool with mine. I am new to this marine stuff someone will be along with more precise answers. But to me that is the reason the recommend periodic exhaust parts replacement. Metal in water rust is inevitable.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:02 am 
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Location: Long Island NY
4Winnsboater wrote:
I have a 1997 5.7GLi. For the past 4-5 years when I winterize the engine, I disconnect a half inch hose fitting located just below the port side head on the engine block. When removed, water and particles of black rust immediately come out of the engine block and hose. Most of it looks like coffee grounds, but when I insert a screw driver or wire into the fitting or hose, larger pieces (1/4") come out. I collect it out of the bilge with a magnet and the amount would fill a shot glass half full.
The boat is primarily used in the fresh waters of the upper Chesapeake Bay. I winterize the engine with
-50 degree RV antifreeze.

Any idea what might be going on? Risers? I haven't noticed any temperature problems...yet.

Any thoughts/ info is appreciated!
Thanks!


Are you referring to draining the block or the exhaust manifold? In either case, it is normal to get rust flakes out of the drains, when cast iron rusts it flakes off. And a 22 year old boat (if orginal engine) will have a lot of internal corrosion even in freshwater. Its just the nature of cast iron. If you are not having overheating problems or any sign of water in the oil I would not worry about it as of yet.

On the other hand, if you see any sign of rust trails emanating from the joint between the exhaust manifold and the exhaust elbow, then it is time to take the exhaust apart to check the manifold and elbow. The gaskets between these 2 parts are known failure points on Volvo and older Merc (Pre-dry joint) exhaust systems. What can happen is if that gasket leaks, water from the outer cooling passages (separted from the exhaust gas passage by just about 3/8s" of cast iron mating surface) can leak into the center exhaust gas passage. This can put water in a cyl via an open exhaust valve and that will cause low compression due to rusting valve stems and seats. Volvo Penta has revised those gaskets a few times. The other thing is the sealing surface gets eroded over time (rust under the gaskets) and even new good gaskets may not seal. You can remove them and have the sealing surfaces re-surfaced at an automotive machine shop if you don't feel comfortable doing it yourself. It is also possible to have leaks from the cooling passages in either the elbow or manifold, and this can also cause raw water leaks back into the engine. I take the exhaust off at 5 years (salt water) and fill the manifolds with acetone, it will find any small crack or hole faster than water will. Usually we replace between 5-7 years here. In fresh water they will last longer but keep in mind, those rust flakes used to part of your exhaust! If they are orginal it may be time to replace. See what the cooling passages look like when you take em apart.

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88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:34 pm 
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Clownfish
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Location: Union Township, Pa.
Thanks for replying LouC. Good to know! It's the original motor and I kinda figured I should've had the manifolds and risers changed some time ago. Since I wasn't experiencing temperature problems, I figured all was well. I certainly don't want to lose the motor to a leaking riser. I'll swing by my local boat shop and get a quote to replace them. Thanks for the info!!

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1997 23.8 Four Winns Vista
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:58 pm 
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Location: Long Island NY
BTW, you can use aftermarket manifolds/elbows if of good quality. I converted my old OMC V6 that had the one piece manifolds to the 2 piece system identical to what V/P uses on their V6s. I used Barr Marine parts and the whole kit was about $710 or so. Got them from Lighthouse Marine AKA partman here on Long Island. Just an option if the mechanic wants to use more expensive OE Volvo parts.

https://www.marineengineparts.com/barr- ... ust-outlet

this is probably what you have, it's not a bad job if you can get the bolts loose.

_________________
88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:16 pm 
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Clownfish
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Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:54 pm
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Location: Union Township, Pa.
Stopped by the boat shop. They're in disbelief that they've lasted this long. They use either Barr or Sierra replacement parts. Unless requested by the customer, they stay away from Volvo because when shipping is added, they're practically double the price. As you stated, their concern is the 22 year old bolts.
I thought about doing it myself, but I think I'll bite the bullet, lay out the cash and pass the potential headaches onto someone else.
I'm waiting for them to get back to me with a quote. $$$$ :shock: I'll be shopping for a defibrillator this weekend.

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1997 23.8 Four Winns Vista
Bay Dream'n


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:20 pm 
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Location: Long Island NY
Yep you never know with bolts that have not been moved in all those years...hint...it helps to warm the engine up first. I would warm up the engine drain the manifolds (watch the water will be hot) and try to break the bolts loose with an electric impact gun. I was able to remove a 19 year old O2 sensor on our β€˜98 Jeep by warming it up. Cold it would not budge. And the impact gun is how I removed all of the intake and head bolts on my old raw water cooled (15 years in salt) engine. Did not break one bolt, it was all original 29 years old when I did the top end overhaul in β€˜17. Installed reman heads new gaskets and all new head bolts. It had overheated in β€˜13 and blew both head gaskets in’16.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tr23hyy6srwfn ... l.JPG?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/2pu8ac8x71e5u ... l.JPG?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jiuwl6tcr17k1 ... l.JPG?dl=0


coming back together:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1yyytu26xgohe ... 1.JPG?dl=0

up and running:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/55j6h4dd1u8fv ... 3.MOV?dl=0

_________________
88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II


Last edited by LouC on Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:15 am 
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Location: Long Island NY
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xduba114xng7e ... 9.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3a527i10hyq24 ... n.jpg?dl=0


A couple pix of my exhaust conversion from the old OMC one piece manifolds to the 2 piece center riser style used on most Volvo Penta 4.3s. The first pic shows how to use a longer bolt with the head cut off to line up the gaskets and slide the manifold on. The 2 longer headless bolts will hold the manifold in place while you install the rest of the bolts. Much easier and you just cut a slot where the head used to be and use a big screwdriver to turn it out when done, then install the last 2 bolts. These were Barr replacement parts. They fit great, the only downside was a poor paint job, had to re-paint them with black rustoleum.

_________________
88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:55 pm 
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Clownfish
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Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:54 pm
Posts: 45
Location: Union Township, Pa.
Wow! Those are great looking. Nice job!

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1997 23.8 Four Winns Vista
Bay Dream'n


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 10:19 am 
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Location: Long Island NY
Thanks its not really a bad job if the bolts come out. My OMC used studs and nuts that were cad plated I think and they never rusted. So to change the OE manifolds all I had to do was loosen the exhaust hoses on the Y pipe (prying with long thin screwdrivers and spraying silicone spray helps) and slide them down. Then remove 4 nuts and the manifolds would slide right off. New set up uses bolts, I used gasket sealer on them to keep them from seizing in place. When the next change has to be done in about 5 years I will just warm up the engine and break em loose with my electric impact gun. It worked GREAT on the head bolts, did not break a single bolt.
When installing new manifolds that use bolts, it is a good idea to get the correct size thread chaser and clean out the threads in the cyl heads. This will make them screw in easier, less likely to seize up or strip.

_________________
88 Four Winns 200 Horizon
4.3 OMC Cobra-4bbl
2002 Walker Bay 10/2012 Suzuki 2.5
2008 Walker Bay 8

1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II


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