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| Another Winterizing question!!!! https://www.smwebhead.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4703 |
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| Author: | chubert [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Guys, I have always used the "flush bucket/ Ear muffs" antifreeze method on my last boat. After a bunch of searches I have found most people seem to run the antifreeze through the system and leave it in the motor all winter. With my previous Merc 3.0 I have always run the RV stuff through the motor until it comes out the exhaust (about 4-5 gallons) and then drained it back out of the block after. Anyone else do it my way or have I been wrong all these years???? I always thought the antifreeze was really just insurance if there were still pockets of water that may not drain. Thoughts?? |
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| Author: | cougarcruiser [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Why not just keep the antifreeze in the block? You know it won't freeze - and it'll keep everything lubed up - so when you launch in the spring - you just put it in the water and go. You do that - then you drain the block -- which is totally fine also. Splitting hairs... |
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| Author: | Cap'n Morgan [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
I have always left the AF in the block over the winter. Made me sleep better knowing it was protected, no matter what. |
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| Author: | captkevin [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Have always left the block full of antifreeze. Was always told that by having the block full of anti-freeze prevents rust that would be possible if the block was empty. Not sure if it is true but have owned a boat for 20 years & have never had a problem. |
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| Author: | 230 Mike [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Heck, just leave it in there. If I had a good way to recover it, I'd fill mine with green AF and recover it in the spring. |
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| Author: | Walt [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 4:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
I use the pink stuff, and I go both ways  Been doing it for nearly 10 years and the only time I f-ed up was not letting the engine get warm enough to get AF through the exh manifolds. After that, but before I had the single point drain, I would drain each manifold and block individually making sure it was really "pink". It's staying in this year. Keeping the block full will, at a minimum prevent air from getting in thus minimizing oxidation/corrosion. |
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| Author: | LouC [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 4:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
chubert wrote: Guys, I have always used the "flush bucket/ Ear muffs" antifreeze method on my last boat. After a bunch of searches I have found most people seem to run the antifreeze through the system and leave it in the motor all winter. With my previous Merc 3.0 I have always run the RV stuff through the motor until it comes out the exhaust (about 4-5 gallons) and then drained it back out of the block after. Anyone else do it my way or have I been wrong all these years???? I always thought the antifreeze was really just insurance if there were still pockets of water that may not drain. Thoughts?? Actually what you were doing was less risky than leaving it in...if you sucked it up the drive...the problem with sucking it up the drive (raw water cooling only) is that the engine may not warm up enough to open the 'stat...and what you can wind up with is manifolds full of AF and the block and heads full of a weak AF/raw water mix (provided the block was not drained BEFORE running in the AF). I tried this method the first year and checked the block drains and found a weak AF/water mix there...so I drained and just backfilled through the hoses. One thing to keep in mind....no sterndrive manufacturer not Merc not Volvo nor OMC ever recommended sucking AF up the drive to winterize a raw water cooled sterndrive So I'd say to people who do this it's at your own risk (sure you can be lucky and have a warmer day the engine warms up faster and opens the stat..) and you don't get nailed with a cracked block...but truth be told you will never know just how close you came....and since most of you guys are all in freshwater areas...just drain it....air doesn't freeze...but drain plugs DO rust in place if you never take them out! Merc, Volvo and OMC have all listed optional procedures to use AF to reduce corrosion in storage...but they all recommend...draining...and backfilling....and that's what I do.....-100 AF (doesn't freeze till 50-40 below....) and no worries....and less rust... |
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| Author: | Graham R [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 4:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Lou, I am not one to argue with 20 years of experience about US conditions as we rarely get below -4 or -5 deg C ( 23 deg. F) here. Admittedly, all my boats have had closed cooling (being brought up on the coast and seeing how quickly things rust, I couldn't stand the thought of salt water inside the blocks/ heads). However, when I winterize my engines the raw water pump seemed very efficient at sucking up raw water/ antifreeze; 20 litres/ 35 pints are sucked through in no time when the engine is hot, so I reckon there can be no dead spots. Graham |
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| Author: | LouC [ Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Graham doing it that way with closed cooling is just fine....all you need to do is to get it through the raw water pump...heat exhanger and manifolds (if a half system)... It's when you try to get it into a raw water cooled engine with a closed thermostat...the water in the block does not circulate out.. .unless the thermo opens all the way (165 *F or so) and an idling engine with cold water on a cool fall day may take a good 1/2 hr just to warm up...the fact that the water in the block does not circulate out the exhaust...means the AF will not make it in the block enough to mix with the water to give adequate freeze protection...and all you will accomplish is exhaut manifolds full of AF.... What all the non-believers should do is take a sample of what comes out of your engine drains.... after trying to suck up the AF....get a dixie cup...drain some out and put it in the freezer...watch what happens.... |
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| Author: | chubert [ Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Thanks for the replies. I was not really thinking about the corosion factor. I will probably leave it in this year. Since we were going to have some frost last I did a quick drain of the block,risers,water pump last night. Now I will be sure there is only AF in there when I do the bucket trick this weekend... My old boat had a stuck thermostat so it always circulated the in the block...... |
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| Author: | ht32bsx115 [ Wed Oct 14, 2009 3:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Well, do not take a chance. drain the block and manifolds completely, FIRST (then remove the petcocks and use a piece of wire etc to clear out the rust and debris from the drain holes......) THEN if you like, you can pour in the A/F. Cheers, Rick |
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| Author: | Graham R [ Wed Oct 14, 2009 4:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Even with the luxury of closed cooling, for corrosion the manifolds/ risers are a concen. OK, I have the Neutraflush system plus the std VP flush system, which basically only flushes the heat exchanger/ manifolds/ risers Even with all that, the exhaust manifold drains get plugged; every year I remove the big brass ( bronze?) plugs as well as the smaller ones which screw into them. As an aside, it's incredible how much corrosion is faster at the coast; the same articles which have lasted over 10 years inland with no ill effect, were completely rotten after 1 year at our vacation home. Is salt really carried that much in the air? Graham |
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| Author: | LouC [ Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
Seems to be...certain fittings on light fixtures on houses here unless they are marine quality do not last...and we are not exactly on the ocean...it's Long Island Sound which is brackish but not as salty as the ocean.... I too always have to poke the drain holes in the block and manifolds to get them to drain... I keep filling the engine and manifolds with -100 AF each winter hoping that it will help me get more use out of it...and I can say that the thermostat housing I replaced 6 seasons ago is still not showing flaking rust like the old one was....maybe it works...keep out the air...and there is less oxygen to form iron oxide.... |
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| Author: | jzellers [ Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
I leave the AF in mine also. I warm mine up with water first, then drain the blocks and manifolds (I have to poke a drain once in a while to get the water to start draining). Then I run it again and circulate AF through. I use a sump pump with a large catch basin which acts as a funnel into a shalow bucket that the sump fits in. I figure draining the water first will eliminate the chance that any significant water pockets are left to dilute the AF. Joe |
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| Author: | Tom H [ Tue Nov 03, 2009 5:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another Winterizing question!!!! |
I have obtained a copy of Volvo Penta's oficial "laying up" guide from the Volvo stand at the Southampton boat show. It says on AF in the engine "Leave the liquid in the system, it provides good protection against freezing and corrosion" It also gives instructions as to how to suck it into the engine. I ran the engine for about 20 minutes on a continous circulation of 20 litres of 50/50 mix untill good and hot (2/3 way from cold to hot on the guage and steaming liquid coming out of the engine. Is that enough to protect me for winter or am I getting paranoid and going to lie awake at night listening for the sound of a cracking block? thanks |
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