www.iFourWinns.com

Hi Guys!!

I am still new to the boards. I posted last year about VDO replacement.
i have been searching the forum for trailer brake issues.

I am having issues with my FW trailer. I will start with the symptoms.
-I have a loud banging sound when pulling away from a stop sign.
-trailer brakes locking up while reversing. with trailer plugged in.
-i do find these occur intermittently.
-fluid in master cylinder is full.
-I have never once serviced brakes.
-trailer is a 2000 model year.
-surge, with disks.
-Titan Aero 6000 coupler. original.

Other things I have noticed,
-no issues reversing at a ramp with decent slope.
-a flat area before the ramp, brakes can lock.

My pal that taught me about boating, always told me to disconnect my trailer wire from my truck before backing boat into water. He said its easier in trailer lights. Is this correct?

His trailer did not have a reverse lockout like my FW trailer.

By reading the posts, my guess is the reverse lockout solenoid?

Thanks fellas for any thoughts.

_________________
2000 Four Winns Horizon 180 LS
2005 Toyota Tundra
Riding Mountain National Park

Sounds like you could have a couple of different things happening. First, yes, it sounds like your reverse lockout solenoid has either failed or is not getting a good connection somewhere. Before replacing it, I would check to be sure you're getting ~12V where the solenoid is connected (with the vehicle in reverse obviously). Those solenoids are not terribly reliable in my experience (I'm on my 3rd one) so if yours is original at 13 years old, it would not be a shock if it has failed.

On the clunk when taking off - is it sound only, or do you feel it as well? If you feel it, that would usually be an indication that your master cylinder is low/empty. Since that isn't the case, it may be that the master cylinder and/or brake lines need to be bled. There should be no sound and nearly no lurch, when the brake system is fully filled with brake fluid and has no air in it. If it's a loud bang but you don't feel anything, then you may have a problem with your hitch, the tongue, or a trailer spring.

As to disconnecting the trailer harness before backing in - with incandescent lights it is better to disconnect because the bulbs have a chance to cool off before hitting the cold water. But, lots of people still suffer with broken bulbs even when they disconnect because their fixtures aren't as waterproof as they should be. Honestly one of the best things you can do for yourself and your trailer is to swap out all the lights for LED fixtures. They're brighter and they don't heat up & fail when dunked.

_________________


Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

He's having the same issue I had. The actuator needs to be replaced as the dampener is shot. This is what prevents the banging on accelerating from a stop or braking. In my case, I wasn't losing fluid, but I had banging. Replacing the brake actuator fixed it.

_________________
2011 SL242 5.7 VP GXi - 320 HP Dual Prop

Interesting, I've never heard of those dampers failing. I do know that with some actuators, the damper has to be re-primed if the fluid gets low, and they won't work right until that is done, even though there's nothing wrong with them.

_________________


Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

Yes, on the model on my trailer, its self priming, it was a tiedown engineering model 125, the rubber seal had popped out of the dampener.

_________________
2011 SL242 5.7 VP GXi - 320 HP Dual Prop

I had very similar intermittently over the summer. I did bleed the brakes and used a pry bar to pump them, without change. I pulled the actuator, checked it electrically, and found it worked OK. Cleaned up the elec connections to the harness and ground. No issues since. I assume just a poor elec conn (probably the ground). I suggest trying those first before replacing the actuator.

_________________
Walt B
"Debt-Charged"
Black '07 H210SS
6.2L Bravo One turning a 21P HIFive
Wakeboard Tower with Perfect Pass Stargazer version
Missouri River; Kansas City, Mo.

And just to state the obvious, if you disconnect your wiring before backing down the ramp, you'd need to manually engage the reverse lockout...

On my 2002 trailer, the actuator is a Dico/Aero 6000 (same as Titan, I guess) - mine clunks also. New ones are cheap on ebay.

Erik

_________________
2002 Funship 214
VP 5.7 GX Si
2003 Tahoe

One more data point - I was having some goofy brake issues after the July 4th weekend this year. Due to moving the boat 3 hours away at the time, I just turned it over to the shop to deal with. Rather than screwing around with it they just replaced the actuator (Tie Down LP7000) and I was surprised at how cheap that was. Just something to consider before spending tons of time on it.

In my case, the rubber brake line in the swing-away tongue developed a crack near one of the fittings, allowing most of the fluid to leak out while the trailer sat at the marina over the weekend. After I discovered that and filled it up to limp back to storage, the dampener didn't prime properly so it still didn't work 100%. The price for the actuator was $155 and the price to have a new hose made up (longer than the original to reduce stress on it) was $45. I think the hose could've been replaced and the old actuator re-primed and it would've been fine, but at normal labor rates it was cheaper to go with a new actuator.

To the OP though, this has nothing to do with your lockout solenoid, which still sounds either failed or bad connection to me.

_________________


Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

Thanks guys for the input. I will keep this in mind when I get back up to the lake in the spring.

There were a couple other symptoms that I recalled.

-the brakes sounded like they were dragging.
-I can hear grinding metal when my wife slowly pulls the boat out of the driveway.
-intermittent issue.
-there is a loud bang that I can hear and REALLY feel when pulling away from stop.
-the manual lockout seemed VERY loose.
-it would not stay in place if I applied it.

To be honest when I first got the boat, I never used the manual lockout. I just disconnected the 5 flat plug and backed in without issue. Then slowly that started to change as the brakes began activating.

So guys what does it look like when everything is working properly?
-should I be able to move the manual lockout easily?

Thanks again guys!!

_________________
2000 Four Winns Horizon 180 LS
2005 Toyota Tundra
Riding Mountain National Park

I had my share of trailer problems as well, but have worked them out. My actuator is the tiedown 70LP. It's manual indicates that the dampener must be primed by fully compressing the actuator and slowly pulling it back out 3 times with the master cylinder completely full. After priming the master cylinder then bleed the brakes. I always gravity bleed first by jacking up the tongue as far as possible with a floor jack then opening the bleeder screws until I get good flow. This is done with the master cylinder cap open. After that, bleed starting with closest axle and the closest brake on that axle to the master cylinder. This is the opposite of how you would bleed brakes on a car. Whenever I had air in the system, I had terrible clunking when starting and stopping. Since repairing all of my issues (leaking master cylinder, blown hose in swing tongue, broken brake line on rear axle), things are working correctly. No clunk, brakes engage as expected.

Regarding the back-up problem, I had a similar problem. On occasion, I would go to back-up and the brakes would engage. In each instance, I had blown the trailer back-up light fuse. My 2005 tahoe with towing package has separate fuses for trailer lights. Turns out, I had a short in the wiring inside the tongue. I replaced that entire section of wire and no more fuse problems. I used a test light at the trailer plug on the truck to determine that I did not have current to the reverse pin (center I believe) when the truck was in reverse. This is how I discovered the separate trailer fuses.

Good luck. Trailer problems can be frustrating, but I'm sure you will get to the bottom of it.

_________________
Seth




2005 210 Horizon
5.0L GXi
"Don't Think Twice"

I've noticed my reverse lock-out will (the majority of the time) engage when backing up a flat or inclined surface, but never at the ramp. I just engage the manual override before backing into the driveway, then release before I take off again. Its been like that since I bought the thing new.

_________________
2008 FW F204 - 5.0 VP "Stand On It"
Former Boat: Larson 186 LXI - 4.3 VP

I bought this to replace my original actuator:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231212808439?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

It's apparently on my doorstep waiting for me. I offered them $50 and they accepted ($80ish with shipping).

I'll see if this helps with my clunking sound when pulling from a stop.

Erik

_________________
2002 Funship 214
VP 5.7 GX Si
2003 Tahoe

As far as unplugging your trailer lights when at the ramp, I always do. If your connections to the lights themselves aren't water tight (and lets be honest here) who's are? You are introducing water into an electircal system and that is not a good thing, it can cause issues shorting out the tow vehicle and that is not a good thing.

_________________
1990 Four Winns Horizon 200
2005 GMC Sierra

If you can show me any water-based solution that will "short out" at 13.8 volts, please let me get in on this deal... it would be a great environmentally friendly replacement for the mercury used in mercury switches.

I am just saying any time you introduce water into an electircal system it cannot be good. Why take a chance on it happening and ruining your day?

_________________
1990 Four Winns Horizon 200
2005 GMC Sierra