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Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
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Author:  88Liberator261 [ Fri Jul 10, 2009 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
The good news was the boat checked out real good. Drives in great shape (except the issue below with the prop shaft). Motors run strong. Didn't do a leak down because he said it was too tight to get to the outside banks - changing the plugs were a real chore.

...there was a bent prop shaft - about 1/4 inch - it was replaced. He put it on the lathe to show me how bad it was - it was real bad. He said the drive that he replaced the shaft in looked brand new (the seller reported 250 hours on these "new" drives"). Used the alignment tool, serviced both drives...

The plugs were TOAST - all rusty above the threads, but they looked like they were burning clean - they were the wrong type too (not marine grade?). Changed the points and condensers.

One of the distributors timing was set at ZERO degrees, the other was correct at 32-34...so he reset the other one. He adjusted the carbs, the electric chokes, replaced the raw water pumps, oils and filters, went through it with a fine tooth comb.

Also, has anyone ever heard of "Queen Cobra Outdrives" instead of King Cobra? If so, what's the difference - I was told mine weren't Kings, but Queens and they are very heavy duty...the difference between the two sounds like the difference between the old King Cobras (different shift point/linkage) - and the newer King Cobras - but he said mine was the "old style" King Cobras (and were referred to as Queen Cobra) and they had the real heavy duty bottom end...compared to the new style King Cobras...but the new King Cobras were used on the Big Cube Engines (bigger than 460 I asked him???).
I'm ready to go, got my license and numbers today. Got to put them on this evening!

DON'T forget the PLUG!!!! :oops: :roll: :shock: :shock:
Author:  LouC [ Fri Jul 10, 2009 10:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
Well I never heard them referred to as Queens but from reading my OMC manuals the King with the 460 was the dog clutch drive...same upper unit as the regular Cobras.... but with a larger lower unit than the ones used on the 4.3/5.0./5.7 Cobras...There was another King Cobra that came out in 1990 that was paired up with the Chevy 454 and this drive was completely different than the other Cobras...much bigger and with cone clutch engagement....only made for 3 years so they are rare...I did see one on a Liberator with a 454...hard to get parts for at this point...
Author:  ht32bsx115 [ Sat Jul 11, 2009 1:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
Quote:
and the newer King Cobras - but he said mine was the "old style" King Cobras


Yeah,

I'm with Lou. There was never a "Queen" Cobra. OMC used the term quite loosely. 87, 88, 89 King Cobras were Dog-clutch, unique models....90 and above were cone-clutch, Pre-Volvo/SX drives....even more unique.

Be very careful with them. There's some parts that are simply NOT AVAILABLE any more for them and those parts are "show-stoppers" (This is why I pulled the 460/KC from my boat while it was still in running condx)

Good luck,


Rick
Author:  jvthundercat [ Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
Sounds Great! Make sure you get us some picks out on the water. I am looking forward to the report.
I got my 2nd build kit in yesterday, so it won't be very long before I get this bad boy running.
I also got my shaft tool made from one of my boys.
Author:  88Liberator261 [ Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
Rick..., I'll have to make that choice - retrofit - when I get there. Right now, I'm happy to try things the way they are - I'm a newby at this I/O stuff, and learning through the forum, and I'm sure I'll still learn some of it the hard way. Thanks for the input - I can handle the thought of 454's and Bravo's down the line if it comes to that! For now, I'm gonna see how the Fords and Cobras work.

LouC...sound easy to understand now- 3 different types out there. I have the King Cobra with the Dog Clutch drive, and the larger lower unit. I need to make sure I have the newer style drive cable (?) that fixed the issue of damage to the drives? I have to research that a little more, saw a post on iBoats about it and no doubt there's one here somewhere.

JV,,,. I have the video camera in the boat ready to go. I'll try to get some good video.
This is going to be a shake down cruise - I'm not intending to push it too hard.

Going tomorrow morning (Sunday) :mrgreen:
Author:  ht32bsx115 [ Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
Yeah, you basically have what you have. Mine ran 20+ years without a problem.

You do need to make absolutely sure that you do some things (that you have already done) to prevent them from self destructing....

If you or someone else changed the drive oil ensure that it's done IAW the OEM OMC service manual and that they take 108oz of oil.
Initial level checks after refill are with the dipsticks resting on the threads. Subsequent checks are with the dipsticks screwed all the way in.

Quote:
I need to make sure I have the newer style drive cable


That would be the lower shift cable(s). If they're RED they're probably the new ones. OMC tried to contact EVERY owner out there and replaced them under warranty.



Anxiously awaiting pictures and video!! :D




Rick
Author:  jvthundercat [ Sun Jul 12, 2009 10:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
Quote:
I need to make sure I have the newer style drive cable


That would be the lower shift cable(s). If they're RED they're probably the new ones. OMC tried to contact EVERY owner out there and replaced them under warranty.

Rick[/quote]

I have red one's. I am glad to know that.
Author:  ht32bsx115 [ Sun Jul 12, 2009 11:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
By the way,

Even if you do have the "RED" cable.......if it doesn't shift right, or the idle is more than about 650RPM,BOTH will need adjustment.

If the idle is too high you can permanently damage the shift "dogs"

It won't go into gear properly. If the shift cable and ESA micro-switches are not adjusted right it won't come out of gear easily (or at all) shifting in the water..... When everything is adjusted right A Cobra (any model) shifts really nice.
Author:  jvthundercat [ Sun Jul 12, 2009 11:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
The last offshore I had was an OMC 800 drive. Same except for the drive shaft instead of those fingers.
I put in a aftermarket clutch dog and it worked great. It had a better angle on the cuts and a little better heat treat.
The only hard part of that one was getting the shift cable setup right. But as with all these, if you follow by the book, it's not that bad.
Author:  ht32bsx115 [ Mon Jul 13, 2009 2:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
jvthundercat wrote:
The last offshore I had was an OMC 800 drive. Same except for the drive shaft instead of those fingers.
I put in a aftermarket clutch dog and it worked great. It had a better angle on the cuts and a little better heat treat.
The only hard part of that one was getting the shift cable setup right. But as with all these, if you follow by the book, it's not that bad.



Yeah....that was a "stringer" They had their own unique problems.....Again not a bad design per se......BUT OMC is no longer in business.....You have to act accordingly......
Author:  jvthundercat [ Mon Jul 13, 2009 10:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
I had no problem finding 800 parts and plenty of cases and all the parts. These King's are not so much as you have pointed out, but if push comes to shove, you can get them rebuilt and ready to go in a few places.
Author:  ht32bsx115 [ Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
jvthundercat wrote:
I had no problem finding 800 parts and plenty of cases and all the parts. These King's are not so much as you have pointed out, but if push comes to shove, you can get them rebuilt and ready to go in a few places.


The parts availability is not too bad for the Dog Clutch Cobras (2.3L-5.8L compatible drives) The Dog-clutch King is another matter. There's some parts that are just not made anymore by anyone.

You probably know you can get gearsets from GLM and http://www.sterndrive.info/chart.html

A few (critical) parts are probably going to either be NOS or will have to be cannibalized from parts units. There's a guy over on iBoats that's looking for #35 in the picture below. (OMC #0912387 DRIVESHAFT-LOWER)

It doesn't look like it can be bought new unless a dealer has a "New Old Stock" unit. TC Electronics has one or more but they're used. I guess a machine shop could make anything though.....


Image
Author:  jvthundercat [ Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Took My 261 to the Shop - Good thing
You could get that made from between 350 to 600 dollars. 4140 carborized would work well. The time would not be bad except for the heat treatment, as you would wait until like parts are going in and pay a smaller fee. The grind finish would cost the most labor as it's tapered. The bigger issue with these parts is finding someone left in business that can do it.
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