www.iFourWinns.com

When July 4th falls during the week, the Saturday before the 4th is when the lake I go to sets off their fireworks show. It rained all day Saturday, until about 8PM, so they still had the fireworks show. We hustled and got launched and out on the water (I don't have my own dock yet) in time for fireworks. After that we trailered back up, put the boat back in the storage shed, and hoped Sunday would be a better day to go out for fun on the lake. No luck-rain all day; we gave up at noon on Sunday and drove back home.

So, I sneak out of work at about 4PM on Tuesday. I load up the wife & boy, make the 2 hour drive to our place at the lake, and am settled in for a nice mid-week day at the lake on the 4th of July. We invite another couple down, and the five of us are set for a day of fun on the water-starting early in the morning. I pull the boat over to the gas station, get gassed up, and turn the key on to see whether the tank is actually full after the pump shut itself off. Gas gauge goes to "1/2" and stops. Interesting. Disturbing. Especially when I just paid for a full tank.

I quickly realize that my radio doesn't work, nor does my blower or horn. I've got no power. "Not to worry," I think, "I'll just click my battery switch over to the other battery at the ramp and start it up, then switch it back and let it charge while we ride." So, I go to flip the switch and find that it is on "Both." What does this mean? It means both batteries are dead and I need a jump.

So, I pull the boat back to my place and get it jumped using my buddy's vehicle that he drove. No problem there. The problem? I have a habit of always turning on the blower at low speeds (a good habit), even when putting the boat on the trailer at the ramp (I'm a power loader). I must have forgotten to turn off the blower when I got out of the boat on land. Stupid move.

Stupider move? Leaving the battery switch on "Both." I can't even remember when I did that, but I'm willing to bet it never happens again. Worst part is that I've heard all the rules about using one battery one time out, then switching over to other next time out to keep both batteries fresh, and avoiding using "both" unless you have a really good reason to do so.

The lesson? If you are an idiot (like me), then misusing your battery switch can turn you into an even bigger idiot (see, ME). We ended up only losing about an hour on the water total, but it was still embarrassing. I guess it could have been worse: I could have discovered it at the ramp and looked like one of the fools that are frequently written about on these types of forums.

Keep those battery switches away from the "Both" position, folks. Use that only when you need the combined power, and then IMMEDIATELY turn it back to a single battery position. Learn from my embarrassment!:oops:

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Paul
2007 Four Winns Horizon 220
Mercruiser 350 Mag MPI w/ Bravo III Drive
2004 Ford Explorer Limited (V8-AWD)
Pomme de Terre Lake (Southwest Missouri)

Paul, don't feel bad! It happens to most of us at one time or another, and as you indicated, once it happens, you never forget to check the battery switches again! I can not tell you how many times, I actually check the battery position switch before I leave the boat.

The only thing I do differently than you describe is that I Always use the "Cranking (Start) Battery" to start the boat and while running, and then when we are anchored out, and we shut the engine, I switch the battery to the Ship's systems position. (I just have to remember to switch it back to the Starting Battery before I restart the engine) The reason for this is that I have a Cranking Battery for the start battery, and I have a Deep cycle house battery. They are different as the Deep cycle is designed for a prolonged slow draw down, and the Cranking battery is designed for high cranking amps but is not designed for long periods of drawdown. Also, I have checked my manual many times to be sure, and even if the switch is on the starting battery alone, the house battery (ships systems) still get's charged while running.

Some folks like to have 2 batteries that are the same, and run it on both all the time. I guess each to their own!

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'04 FW 268Vista "Andiamo"

Yeah, I've always been of the opinion that "both" shouldn't even be a choice. This is the reason why folks much more knowledgeable than I advocate the installation of an isolator, so that one drained battery won't attempt to be charged by the other good battery.

Even though I have dual batts, I still invested in a jumper pack which stays in the truck and goes on the boat. Hopefully my boat will never need it, but maybe I can keep someone else's day from being ruined. I've actually had to use it a couple of times on my wife's Odyssey. One use and you'll be convinced it was the best $50 you ever spent.

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

I agree. Without an isolator, you have to select which battery to charge when running. Now that I've had some time to try to remember, I'm thinking that was how things got there in the first place. Either way, I am to blame.

An isolator may be getting added to the boat project list soon...

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Paul
2007 Four Winns Horizon 220
Mercruiser 350 Mag MPI w/ Bravo III Drive
2004 Ford Explorer Limited (V8-AWD)
Pomme de Terre Lake (Southwest Missouri)

I've been embarrassed when my engine wouldn't turn over. The "OFF" position will prevent that from happening.

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SOLD! 2006 30th Anniversary Vista 278
"Conch'd Out!"

http://vista278.com

Keep in mind "off" will not pump the bilge in an emergency if you wet dock or more (sp) the boat.

I thought it was a no-no to switch between batteries while running...Im positive its a nono to switch them off while running....

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Guns kill people like spoons make people fat.
2007 Horizon 190 Gxi
97 Pathfinder SE 4x4
73 International Scout II

You're right, switching to 'off' while running is a major no-no, unless you like spending money. You should, however be able to switch from 1 to both to 2 while running, although I just make it a habit to not switch it at all while running .

A properly installed bilge pump will bypass any switching, and run straight from the batteries. FW wires them that way at the factory. I do think anyone who wet slips (and probably everyone, period) ought to double check that to be sure that's the way their boat is wired.

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

You should NEVER switch to "OFF" while the motor is running because the Alternator's Voltage Regulator Diode's will burn out. The reason is because if you remove the load from the alternator circuit (the batteries) the alternator's output will run up higher than it should and in turn cause the diodes to blow.

You also should not switch from 1 to 2 to BOTH while the engine is running, UNLESS you have a "Make Before Break" model of battery switch (which I think most of us with newer boats have). You can always verify that by taking the part number off the switch and then going to the website for the appropriate manufacturer.

The Make Before Break switches will "Make" the connection from the Alternator to Battery 2 before it "Breaks" the connection from the Alternator to Battery 1, that way the Alternator is never without a load.

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Brett DiMichele

It definitely depends on what model switch is installed as to whether it has a field cut off circuit for the alternator. Vendors still sell both styles, with and without the protection. So it's a good rule of thumb to never go flipping that switch when the engine's running. Even if you 'know' the switch has the circuit it's probably not worth the risk.

Yep, the bilge pumps are wired direct to a battery. The do run through a circuit breaker on the battery switch panel.

It's indeed a VERY good idea to confirm whether your bilge pumps are operating properly. The floats for them DO tend to get stuck. Turn the battery switches off (while the engines are off, of course) and disconnect your shore power. This way you know you're on battery power. Then put a hose down in the bilge and add enough water to trigger the bilge pump. Don't point the hose at the float itself. Just fill it gradually. If they don't work then figure out why.

My main engine room switch had crud accumulated in the primary float. The pump would only have run if it had hit the secondary high water float. I only had to give it a good shot of pressure from the hose to clean the gunk out of it. This is why you want to only fill it gradually. You want to know if something's managed to gunk it up so you can work to prevent it from happening again.

So if you haven't checked your bilge pumps lately put it on the To Do list.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

Here's my battery/bilge delemma; the previous owner of my boat bought it new from a FW dealer (Wash state) and had a second battery and Perko switch added. The bilge will now only work if the battery switch is in one of the two on positions. Currently, I leave my house battery on while I have the boat slipped and ensure all other electronics are turned off. The boat never really sits that long between uses and I check on it if it has been raining, so I am confident the battery would power the bilge if required.

When looking at the bilge, the wires "disappear" into the heavy wiring harness in the engine compartment. Does anyone know where and at what point on the boat the bilge would get it's power from based on the old factory system of one battery? With the Perko switch in place, that "point" is now behind the switch, somewhere! The other thing I have considered is to disconnect the bilge from the wiring harness and connect it directly to the battery with inline fuses.

Questions, comments, concerns.

Rod

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2010 278 Vista
5.7 GXi DP

Past:
1999 225 Sundowner
5.7 GSi SX

here is the link to the wiring diagram on Four Winns website. http://www.fourwinns.net/ownman/Classic/WiringDiagram99-00&02.pdf

The whole manual can be found on line under Customer Service

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Jvalich
http://www.badcock.com

'04 FW 288 Vista "Mental Floss"

The other "danger" to turning your batteries to the "off" position that nobody has mentioned is galvanic corrosion. Since I have a B3 drive, the Mercathode system attached to it requires power to operate. Anyone know whether Mercathode is wired like a "properly wired bilge pump"? It is my understanding that it is not, and that Mercathode requires a switched power source to be turned on. Nobody really went over this with me at my delivery, and I keep forgetting to look it up in my Merc manual, which is 100 miles away from me as I type this.

Anyone know the answer?

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Paul
2007 Four Winns Horizon 220
Mercruiser 350 Mag MPI w/ Bravo III Drive
2004 Ford Explorer Limited (V8-AWD)
Pomme de Terre Lake (Southwest Missouri)

Well, no anwser to my previous question but I do have a little more 2007 220H-specific info on this topic. I did figure out that Mercathode is what was running my batteries down if they were left in the 1, 2, or BOTH position.

My priorities recently got mixed up to where I took a vacation to NYC, went to a wedding, and had another family function for 3 straight weekends so I did not get to use my boat for a period of 4 weeks. (Who plans these things to where they interfere with my boating time? Stupid loved ones!!!) Knowing this ahead of time, I turned my battery switch to OFF in dry storage to prevent a complete rundown of my batteries. I don't have power in my storage unit, so a charger to maintain power isn't an option.

Anyhow, when I got back this weekend, I found 2 things as a result of my batteries being in the OFF position:

1. Not only is the auto bilge pump wired directly to the batteries so that the switch position is irrelevant, so is the power trim. I always trim my lower unit down when storing to save the U-joints. First thing I do is get in and run the lower unit back up. I did this before turning the battery switch from OFF.

2. Like previous years' models, I lose the radio's clock and presets when the batteries are switched to OFF. Not sure if they hold for a certain amount of time, or are lost as soon as you turn the switch to OFF.

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Paul
2007 Four Winns Horizon 220
Mercruiser 350 Mag MPI w/ Bravo III Drive
2004 Ford Explorer Limited (V8-AWD)
Pomme de Terre Lake (Southwest Missouri)

Well, I have the FW 2007 manual at hand. And while I can see where wiring for the H220 optional Dual Battery Guest Switch does call for the bilge to be available no matter what the switch setting, I can not see where the trim switch is wired directly to the battery. Even so, my Horizon 200 also allows trim switch function with the key off and out. I do wish more complete wiring digrams were provided. With the Horizon 200, there are two seperate fuse boxes. One at the helm, and another at the engine. I'm thinking one needs to combine the FW and Volvo manuals to grasp what's what and connected where.

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2007 Horizon 200
4.3L GXi/ SX 225 HP

Interesting. My trim pump is switched. I have to leave one of the batteries one so I can use the transom trim switch.

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic