Assortment of questions LouC

Jdpber · **Posted:** Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:12 pm

I have been looking for a while and for the fastest hull speed of a horison hull. So here goes the questions

What is the fastest the horison hull can safely go before it begins to walk?

Has anyone seen a larger than stock motor swapped, the largest was a 5.7 350 stock?

What is the bolt pattern for the engine to drive coupler?

Now wait for it"....................

Has anyone seen or heard of a big block swap into a horison?

I ask because I happen to have a few marine 454s. Long story short between myself and my 2 best friends the 3 of us have and share around 20-25 motors ranging from rc little motors to big 800hp catapillar marine diesel. Ans we have 3 marine 454s.

Just few thoughts I'm my mind tonight.

LouC · **Posted:** Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:44 pm

Well that's a good question, because there was the option of the 454 in the 201 Liberator, which has the same lower hull as my 88 H 200. I bet that boat could do over 60 easily. But not all Horizon hulls are the same.
Looking at the Michigan Motorz website there is an option of a 377 cu in small block with 340 hp, expensive but what a hoot that would be. I don't think there was ever the option of a big block in the Horizon series though. It could be made to fit lol...

NiagaraChillin · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:32 am

Isn't there a rule/law/regulation about exceeding the manufacturers hull vs horsepower rating? Like when you get a safety check, the data on the plate has to match what you have?

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:41 am

NiagaraChillin wrote:

Isn't there a rule/law/regulation about exceeding the manufacturers hull vs horsepower rating? Like when you get a safety check, the data on the plate has to match what you have?

Nobody actually enforces that, it's impossible. There has yet to be a way invented to accurately calculate engine HP by just looking at it.

LouC · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:51 am

That is true for outboard boats but think about it; have you ever seen that on an I/O?

kd4pbs · **Joined:** Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:34 am **Posts:** 350

I think if you are rolling along on the water with your 12' aluminum V-hull rowboat with a huge Mercury Marine ProXS 250, you'd be hard pressed to tell the wildlife officer that he can't give you a ticket because you can't just look at an engine to determine horsepower.

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:59 am

454 is too heavy. You could easily build a 350 that produces 400hp for under a few grand. There's no laws or rules against it, have at it! Install smart tabs to control the walk. That would make your H190 knock on the door of 80mph

NiagaraChillin · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:06 am

Just throwing that out there for discussion, I know the CG doesn't carry portable dyno's to check the HP. But isn't there also a safety aspect to consider? As far as upgrading the horsepower significantly on a hull that may not be designed for it? Especially an older one. I would be concerned about the coupler, transom mounts and drive. I would think increasing the HP, would call for beefing up the other components as well.

Kinda like stuffing a big block in a car and not upgrading the tranny and differential. Just a thought....

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:10 am

There's plenty of go-fast guys putting over 450hp to alpha one's reliably, you just can't punch it full throttle out of the hole and run a good drive shower.

VP SX drive? Throw 500hp at it, it's okay.

Jdpber · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:12 am

my plate sais 8 people XYZ #..

My brother runs a 2014 1546 Alumacraft rated for a 25hp and he has a race mod 15" big bore 65hp johnson on it, with a power jack plate with tilt n trim. He is a marine biologist for DNR (Department of Natural Resources). He can run 40s in 5-6" of water with his surface piercing prop. DNR only questions of fines HIGH HP when it is blatant over power to be dangerous.. EXAMPLE a 250hp on a 17' boston whaler would get a fine. but a 25-28' center console with triple or quad 350s they ask "what does she run?"

as for I/O no one cares.. i say HOT ROD THE **** out of I/O boats..

My ideal next boat is this. Seat 8+ in comfort, wash down fiberglass cockpit, Family Friendly, 20-25', transom with abilities for Thru Hull exhaust "Captains Choice", tow and play, and finally for me over 70mph.

Now i know i am asking for a lot but it does exist and the Baja 247 ISLANDER bow rider does all of these things.. Buddy has a 23 Outlaw Baja which is the same hull as the islander. He has a 550hp BB paired with a Bravo 1 and runs a stable 92gps 1/2 fuel 2 adults. so the hull is capable.

this above example Baja came with a basic 350 and ran 48 from the dealer. IT IS NOT STOCK anymore

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:19 am

That's what I miss about my Stingray. A lot. Low 60's on the GPS.

LouC · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:26 am

It is true that for any of these boats you'd have to upgrade the drivetrain, except if you had a Volvo SX to start with because they did come with big blocks as well. Alpha-->Bravo series. Alpha and Cobra are good to 300 hp. And there is the question of drive ratios as well. For sure you'd want to make sure the transom and engine mount stringers are REALLY solid when you have the engine out. While there is no engine limit on the capacity plate on these boats I do wonder if there was ever an accident due to excessive speed could there be liability if you installed a bigger engine than was ever an option for the boat? My guess is the liability would be more so on the operator for poor judgement in the operation of the vessel (excessive speed) than the engine was too powerful and the owner was negligent in installing that more powerful engine.

We put an outboard on our 10' Walker Bay, its rated for 3 hp lol. So we have a roaring 2.5 hp Suzuki four stroke. It moves it about 5-6 knots but that's as fast as you want to go in that boat. And the Zuke is one of the lightest 4 stroke engines in that size.

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:34 am

I'm actively searching for a smoker craft alaskan 12 utility boat, they're impossible to find used. Rated for 25hp, I plan to install a Merc 35 pull start tiller. With jack plates and trim it should do 40+. I need something for the lake I live on.

Jdpber · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:44 am

I 100% know that their is a max for these hulls when they will walk. But what is that speed? That is the million dollar question? Also one must remember they offered multiple economical engine options for the Horison series. But the did not want to offer too much speed to take away from their Eliminator series aka the FW "SPEED BOAT" so logically you don't make the lines identical otherwise everyone would buy the cheaper one.

Now i feel confident in stating that i do not think that the horizon hull would comfortably ride in the 70s just from my knowledge of hull design i feel that that it has a lower stable speed than say the eliminator and other GO GO hulls. As the horison was designed for family ski and a stable ride.

Now this all being said their is not real evidence that i have found thus so far of anyone "hot Roding" a horizon.

Their are plenty of HOT ROD Stingray, Chaperell, Crownline, sea ray etc etc etc but i have yet to find any FW Horisons.. also yet to find a BB horizon. can the hull hold a BB sure it is only a couple hundred pounds more over all basically one extra fat friend in the rear. Are my stringers good? From what i can inspect with the engine installed they are good and the moisture meeter reads fine in the areas i can meter. but as for total structure the only way to know is have the motor out.

Their are 2 ways to go about Hot Roding a boat in my opinion.
1) slowly over time add a performance part here and their that lead to an engine swap then props then a new drive more parts on new motor and the ever evolving upgrade process.
2) snatch it all out and you toss in a 500+ c.i. BB and an Alpha 1 XR drive and call it a f***ing day, and play with props till it is dialed in. Now i know i am talking about a $3k drive but it is damn near bullet proof. needs no mods to withstand 100+mph and over 600Hp. tons of re gear aftermarket options. available parts out the wazoooo.

I am wanting to find the fastest by a land slide not 1-2mph Horison.

This may involve a friendly phone call to the FW manufacture

ric · **Posted:** Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:49 am

Just take the EFI off your 5.0, throw on some heads, intake, carb, and you'll be well over 400hp. Should do at least 70 and scare the piss out of you.

www.iFourWinns.com

Assortment of questions LouC

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