Water Leaking In To Motor

jontmiller · **Joined:** Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:16 am **Posts:** 296

Hoping for the best for you but it doesn't appear good on the face of it all. I would start with a calm conversation with the douchbag who sold you the boat. While we all understand buyer beware and the importance of doing due diligence before making such a purchase, there is no excuse for someone to unload something that has this many known defects. Then depending on your local laws and comfort level get a picket sign and spend a few days in front of their house explaining that they sold you something under false pretenses.

I buy and sell a lot of things on Craigslist and have found most folks have a common level of decency to explain what they know about the item being sold, there is a chance that the seller was unaware but I seriously doubt it after reading your description.

Feeling bad for you.....I got lucky buying my boat and would do it differently myself next time. good luck

rpengr · **Posted:** Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:44 pm

The Gobs of sealant around the drain plug plate is very strange indeed.

Regarding your question about price: If your transom has extensive rot and need to be rebuilt, then the engine and drive needs to be removed (probably by your local marina), then a different shop would do the wood and fiberglass repair, then the marina would re-install the engine. Ballpark $1500 to $3000?

However, if this leak is caused by the attachment nuts coming loose, and the transom barely has any rot, then it could just be re-tightened and you might be fine for years. These 6 nuts are very hard to get to because they are behind the engine (inside the boat), and they should be very tight. You or a friend might be able to tighten them with wrenches and/or sockets, or your marina could do it. I think there is a post on here about these nuts.

Here is another test you can do and report back to us:
. Bring a big/strong friend with you.
. Have your friend try (hard) to lift the outdrive up & out from the transom, while you watch where it meets the transom looking for movement. Does the outdrive move relative to the transom. Does the fiberglass move at all, or does it appear to be rock solid.
. Have your friend stand on the very back of the outdrive (above the propeller) and bounce up and down with all his/her weight while you look for the same movements at the transom. Especially look for movement of the fiberglass (which should not move).
If the drive moved, but not the fiberglass, you could be in luck and just have loose nuts inside.
If the fiberglass is flexing, you have the rotten wood problem.

rpengr · **Posted:** Tue Jul 07, 2015 3:11 pm

This post talks about the 6 nuts that could be tightened (and how hard it is to get to them)
http://www.smwebhead.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=13130&start=15

This post talks about the transom rot rebuilding topic (including a quote he got)
http://www.smwebhead.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=14132&start=15

ridepate · **Joined:** Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:56 pm **Posts:** 220

This is a little hokey but does prove a point. I've tried it. It does work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn9t2UTYKBI

teefey116 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 06, 2015 3:12 pm **Posts:** 15

Well... After feeling incredibly overwhelmed and having a meltdown in regards to all of the potential problems, I decided to have the marina take a look at it.

They basically said the same thing, there's a leak from between the transom and transom plate. From what they can see, it looks like someone has already tried to temporarily fix it. They also said it looks like there could be some rot but can't say for sure until they pull everything out. In his professional opinion, this boat has been taking on water for years.

As far as the repair, he said he can pull everything out and reseal the transom, with something he called 2300 or 3200 (I can't remember). Which is gonna cost me about $2000 and even then he can't guarantee that it will be a permanent fix, it might get me another 4 years out of the boat because he doesn't know how much rot he will see once he gets in there.

So now I'm at a stand still I guess until I can get some more information. I don't feel comfortable telling him to go ahead with the repair until I have a chance to talk to an attorney. I don't even know it I have any rights in a case like this but what I do know is that I bought a boat for $6000 under the impression that there was nothing *major* wrong with it and he specifically told me that he didn't have a problem with taking in water but stressed to me the importance of using the bilge pump and periodically checking the bilge for water.

I'm beyond frustrated right now and I'm sorry for just ranting at this point but I need to get it off my chest. My bottom line on a boat was $6000, if I had known I would be forking out another $2000+ I wouldn't have bought the boat OR I would have just bought the boat that was ten years newer for $8000. I wasn't expecting a 20 year boat to last forever but I was expecting to enjoy it at least for the summer. I could have taken my daughter to Disney World or bought a pool, but instead her and I get to spend the summer watching my savings account sink, literally.

Thanks to all of you for your support and advice. You have all been a huge help to me.

rpengr · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:31 am

I can't give any advise as to whether you could sue the seller. Was there a bill of sale that says "As-Is"? On the other hand, it looks easy to prove that he knew about it because of the sealer that was added. A phone call to a law office might answer your question about recourse.

$2000 sounds awful high for a repair that just uses more sealer. That doesn't sound like it's going to last. Would rather see you put $2500 into having it done properly.

I would talk to a fiberglass repair shop next before deciding anything. Maybe you can get a good repair within your budget.

If you want to try to get along with an economy repair for awhile, then just have them loosen the outdrive from the transom, insert silicone sealer and re-tighten. Surely they could do that for a few hundred? You also need to fix your float switch for the bilge pump so it works automatically. Then go enjoy the boat for a season or two.

rpengr · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:48 am

It would still be helpful if you put up pictures of that area of the boat. Really reach back behind the engine and take pictures with your camera phone. Also a couple pictures of the inside and outside of the boat so we can see the general condition. Max size picture is 1024 wide x 768 high.

Here is the tutorial about posting pictures:
http://www.smwebhead.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1877&hilit=pictures#p15910

(plagiarized from aguyindallas, who probably plagiarized it from somebody else)

LouC · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:11 am

I look at it like this:
You get the drive and engine out. Get the transom fixed.
Then run it 5-6 years or longer.
It will cost more but after this investment your boat will be better than most any used boat you will find since they are all prone to the same problems
That's what I did with mine (stringers n deck 2007, paint job 2012)...

teefey116 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 06, 2015 3:12 pm **Posts:** 15

Hmmm... I had replied to the last few posts but I'm not seeing it on my end. So hopefully I'm not just repeating all this to you guys.

As far as the repair, I think that's probably my best bet. To just do the sealant myself or have someone do it for a few hundred. If the only reason he really needs to take everything out is to determine if there's more of a problem then I really don't see the point because if it's a $6000 repair, I know I'm not going to do it. Although having an actual quote and proof of that repair and cost would maybe be more beneficial to me in proving that there was something wrong prior to me buying it.

To answer your question, there was no bill of sale that stated this was an "as-is" sale. In fact there was no contract at all written up. I simply handed him a check and he handed me a signed title. I do however have text messages between him and I where I explained that my concern for meeting him at HIS price on the boat was due to the age of the boat and my concern of there being rot, to which he responded that the floor was in excellent condition, no soft spots and the reason he's so hesitant to let it go at a lower price is because he knows how great the condition of the boat is, compared to the same boat other people are selling for an even higher price.

I will say, the floor was in pretty amazing condition, which surprised me for a 20 year old boat that was not kept in a garage and did not have a waterproof cover. Especially considering my dad had a brand new pontoon boat and after just a few years the floor was far shabbier looking than this boat. Perhaps he just took better care of it, but it turns out he's a carpenter and works for some carpet store, which now makes me think he probably replaced the carpet and who knows what else he replaced while he was at it.

I realize I'm probably pointing out all of these things that anyone else would have seen as a big huge red flag and would have just walked away. But what can I say, I walked into this not knowing anything about boats and maintenance. I've been on boats my whole life, but my dad took care of all this. He was the one who took us out on the boat and worked on the boat and hell he did that with my car and anything else that required maintenance, but my dad passed away and my mom sold his boat. I missed the memories of being out on the boat with him and wanted to be able to do the same thing for my daughter. I guess I thought I was capable of doing it on my own, but apparently I've proved I wasn't quite ready to take on such a huge task. This has definitely been a costly eye opener.

I will also try to get some better photos. The ones I took all seemed to be in one central location but when I go back out to pick the boat up from the marina I'll try and get some more photos of everything so that I can post them on here and maybe some of you can see what I can't.

As far as an attorney goes, I have made a few calls. I'm just waiting for some call backs. I'm certainly not trying to screw this guy, like it so far appears he has done to me. But I wasn't expecting to sink $2000 or more into repairs after having the boat a week and if this is something that was clearly a problem prior to me buying it, then I feel it's only fair, at the very least, to try and come to some type of agreement regarding the cost of repairs on the boat. Ultimately, I just want to get back on the water this summer so that I can enjoy it, even if it is a temporary fix. I just don't feel it's right that it all falls on me. Yeah yeah yeah, "Buyer Beware", I get it. It just royally sucks.

And LouC, I just saw your post as I was about to submit this. That's a very valid point, if I go through with the repair, it will be in significantly better condition then any other boat it's age, but at this point, it's the principle of the entire transaction. I would have felt a lot better about this type of repair and even probably expected something major after a few years, but after a few hours on the water... definitely not what I was expecting, and I'm certainly not in the position for a $2000 repair, let alone a $6000 repair.

DougT01 · **Joined:** Wed May 20, 2015 6:44 pm **Posts:** 121

I wouldn't get a lawyer involved.
The amount you're talking about falls into Small Claims Court.
No lawyers allowed. In my county, you can file a suit for up to $3000

I just won a suit for my son where someone didn't disclose defect in house.
The Home Inspector returned his $500 too.

You can see step by step instructions on your County Website.

Cost to file is about $38 total including official delivery of notice to appear.

JMHO,
Doug

rpengr · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:41 pm

Well I don't see this being anywhere near $6000 repair no matter what.

Aside from the legal advise, I really recommend that your next step is find a fiberglass repair shop in your area and discuss this with them. I've seen transom repairs on u-tube (by a qualified shop) that were done from the outside of the boat. Fiberglass and wood were cut away from outside, and rebuilt from outside, then painted matching color. Engine might not even need to be pulled out...just removal of the outdrive which is not that much labor.

Fiberglass repair shops generally have a lower labor cost per hour than any marina. I'm hoping that maybe you could get a decent repair done for $2000, instead of your marina's $2000 for who knows what.

But I don't see any harm in doing sealer and tightening the nuts and getting by with this for the summer (as long as the boat won't stay in the water when not in use). Your previous owner got by with this for years, apparently. Try to have some fun with it before you sink in more money.

LouC · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:55 pm

True I did a patch job on my deck in 2003 and used it that way till it got bad in 2005 when 2 things happened; has tank got loose because 3/4 mounts rotted off; and my foot went through the deck while winterizing it in 2005. Fixed it in 06/07. Still solid and the boat looks way newer than it is...
Boats are long term projects and if you think of it that way the reality is easier to take. If we want trouble free guaranteed then we have to buy much newer boats like 5 years old or less...

schoolsOut · **Posted:** Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:41 pm

Have you contacted the seller yet? I would start there. Maybe he can shed some light on the history. You could point out the sealer and the obvious attempt to stop some sort of leak. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he will recognize that his previous fix did not work and make things right even if it means buying the boat back or giving you cash toward the repair.

ridepate · **Joined:** Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:56 pm **Posts:** 220

Don't beat yourself up over it. Even brand-new boats have issues. I'd get the transom-plate bolts tightened, caulk it up with 3M 5200 Marine Sealant around the outside of the plate and wake-on! Is that the 100% correct way? No, but it will work. I've done it with no issues. Also don't let a marina tell you the engine has to be pulled to tighten the transom-plate. It does not! not an easy task and you have to learn to contort in some strange ways......lol but it can be done!

ridepate · **Joined:** Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:56 pm **Posts:** 220

Here's a pic where someone has sealed around the transom-plate. See the grey-stuff? Not 5200 as it is white. Like I say. Correct way? No. But it will get you by for a season or two until you decide what to do.

www.iFourWinns.com

Water Leaking In To Motor

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