Lake Prep 2014 -- Share Your Prep & Ask Questions

LouC · **Posted:** Wed May 14, 2014 8:08 pm

I don't know what engines you guys have, but look at this link and you can probably find the cooling system schematic for your engine:

http://www.volvopentastore.com/Engine-P ... ore_id.366

In about 99% of all cases, the P/S cooler will be somewhere inline between the raw water pump on the engine and the transom mount. On the Joint Venture Volvo/OMC models (1994-1998 for OMC, 94 and later for Volvo) with V6/V8 engines the PS cooler is behind the engine, hiding behind the left hand exhaust manifold/riser as looking at it from the front of the engine. You will really have to get down behind the engine to see it. My boat has a trim piece that comes off right above this area so I can get at it. On other engines it can be on the side of the engine, spliced in between the raw water intake hose coming from the transom. The cooler itself looks like a small cylinder with a hose fitting on each end. It will also have hydraulic lines that run to the PS pump threaded into it.
Other things to check (admittedly not easy by any means) is the other small hose that goes from the pivot housing to the transom mount on the outside. This can be seen by trimming up the drive and turning it to the right, it will be in the left side of the transom mount. Its a fact of life that these screw clamps get loose and you're going to be better off if you add checking them to your get ready routine.

The reason why I am making this known to others is that this hose popped off the P/S cooler on my boat last summer. It overheated the engine and filled the bilge with water REALLY fast. This is because the Cobra impeller is in the drive. And, its a high output impeller like the one on the Volvo engine mounted one. On a Volvo, it would overheat but not fill the boat with water (unless one of the hoses to the pump popped off lol). In the Cobra, this hose gets the full pressure of the impeller output. In the Volvo this hose is under suction, so its not as likely. But, that hose between the raw water pump and the thermo housing is under pressure in the Volvo design and can pop off with the same result.

And because of its hidden location, it gets overlooked. This thing sprayed salt water all over the place. At first I thought I had an overheated engine and leaking bellows. But, as soon as I shut off the engine the water stopped coming in. Then I knew it had to be that little bastig of a hose. I had the boat towed in but I could have waited to let it cool off and just re-connect the hose.
I had rust on spark plugs, fuel filter, carb choke blade, etc.

Live and Learn, driveway marine mechanics......

jontmiller · **Joined:** Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:16 am **Posts:** 296

Well, I raise the drive to bring her to the lake (in the rain of course) and notice this dripping, my initial thought is I over serviced the gear oil in the fall, or this is excess drippage from making a mess in the fall. Thoughts from the driveway crowd? The puddle of oil grew pretty quick and now has stopped fwiw.

photo 2.JPG by millerjont, on Flickr

photo 3.JPG by millerjont, on Flickr

photo.JPG by millerjont, on Flickr

rpengr · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 9:54 am

jontmiller wrote:

Well, I raise the drive to bring her to the lake (in the rain of course) and notice this dripping, my initial thought is I over serviced the gear oil in the fall, or this is excess drippage from making a mess in the fall. Thoughts from the driveway crowd? The puddle of oil grew pretty quick and now has stopped fwiw.

I am not certain on this one, as I have more experience with the Cobra cable, not VP, but here are my thoughts...

I suspect that this is from grease that was applied on your shift mechanism under the back cover of your drive. I certainly don't think that this cable passes through the gear oil chamber, but rather a "dry" passageway from the location of your picture, to the back where the shift linkage can be seen.

I would take off the back cover (three screws on plastic cover), and see if there is any grease/oil back there that is the same color. Some kinds of light grease can exude some oil over time.

If I am right about this, then you do not have any problem. Since the plastic cover is not waterproof, then this area is already exposed to sea water, so there is not an issue with a seal. Just wipe up the oil and go boating.

Ray

jontmiller · **Joined:** Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:16 am **Posts:** 296

EDIT....you are correct. Pulled the rear cover and a pool of brand new gear oil was still waiting to be cleaned up from the fall. ...also lots of zebra mussels that needed to be cleaned out....

Crisis averted

Thanks for the quick response

Now if it would just stop raining on my clean boat

rpengr · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 10:08 am

jontmiller wrote:

EDIT....you are correct. Pulled the rear cover and a pool of brand new gear oil was still waiting to be cleaned up from the fall. ...also lots of zebra mussels that needed to be cleaned out....

Crisis averted

Thanks for the quick response

Now if it would just stop raining on my clean boat

Great! As long as you don't have a leaking seal back there, or a missing/leaking vent plug. I would pull that cover again and inspect after your next outing. Also re-check the oil level.

LouC · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 10:36 am

Looks like the input shaft seal, drive needs to come off and go to the shop.
Get it pressure tested while you are at it.

weather · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 1:00 pm

LouC wrote:

I don't know what engines you guys have, but look at this link and you can probably find the cooling system schematic for your engine:

http://www.volvopentastore.com/Engine-P ... ore_id.366

In about 99% of all cases, the P/S cooler will be somewhere inline between the raw water pump on the engine and the transom mount. On the Joint Venture Volvo/OMC models (1994-1998 for OMC, 94 and later for Volvo) with V6/V8 engines the PS cooler is behind the engine, hiding behind the left hand exhaust manifold/riser as looking at it from the front of the engine. You will really have to get down behind the engine to see it. My boat has a trim piece that comes off right above this area so I can get at it. On other engines it can be on the side of the engine, spliced in between the raw water intake hose coming from the transom. The cooler itself looks like a small cylinder with a hose fitting on each end. It will also have hydraulic lines that run to the PS pump threaded into it.
Other things to check (admittedly not easy by any means) is the other small hose that goes from the pivot housing to the transom mount on the outside. This can be seen by trimming up the drive and turning it to the right, it will be in the left side of the transom mount. Its a fact of life that these screw clamps get loose and you're going to be better off if you add checking them to your get ready routine.

The reason why I am making this known to others is that this hose popped off the P/S cooler on my boat last summer. It overheated the engine and filled the bilge with water REALLY fast. This is because the Cobra impeller is in the drive. And, its a high output impeller like the one on the Volvo engine mounted one. On a Volvo, it would overheat but not fill the boat with water (unless one of the hoses to the pump popped off lol). In the Cobra, this hose gets the full pressure of the impeller output. In the Volvo this hose is under suction, so its not as likely. But, that hose between the raw water pump and the thermo housing is under pressure in the Volvo design and can pop off with the same result.

And because of its hidden location, it gets overlooked. This thing sprayed salt water all over the place. At first I thought I had an overheated engine and leaking bellows. But, as soon as I shut off the engine the water stopped coming in. Then I knew it had to be that little bastig of a hose. I had the boat towed in but I could have waited to let it cool off and just re-connect the hose.
I had rust on spark plugs, fuel filter, carb choke blade, etc.

Live and Learn, driveway marine mechanics......

Thanks Lou. Looks like I'll need to use a VPN to get to the site - they don't let us Canadians see the US site.

jontmiller · **Joined:** Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:16 am **Posts:** 296

LouC wrote:

Looks like the input shaft seal, drive needs to come off and go to the shop.
Get it pressure tested while you are at it.

curious on your diagnosis Lou, in the fall I changed out the gear oil and it was clean/water free. I know for a fact I made a pretty good mess filling it back up. I had never pulled the cover off until today so I don't know if there was any oil there prior. This spring I simply checked the oil level, greased the gimbal bearing and did the other prep before putting it in the water. I am suspicious (or perhaps hopeful) there was a pool of oil in there all winter than when raising the drive all the way for the trip to the docks gave it an avenue to leak out. (the drive is rarely all the way up when on the trailer) other than idling in the driveway a few times the drive hasn't gotten any use since last season.

Anyways....in my heart I know the right thing to do, I also know the drive needs to be pulled to be looked at in general. (2nd full season of 3 with the boat and no maintenance on my end) but in my reality driven world of already having the boat in the water, having a broken trailer with marginal towing vehicle. What should I be looking for over the next few outings. Is there much to see with the drive in the water besides checking the level? I am going to price a few of the shops around the area all the same.

I should add there is beer of your choice if you ever want wander up to a boring lake and tinker with my boat instead of yours

LouC · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 4:22 pm

I was replying on my phone and didn't see the reply from Ray, if you did spill some gear oil in that area last fall and did not tilt up the drive till now, its possible that it could have come from there. If you trim it down, then trim it up again and it continues leaking then you have to pull the drive and look at that seal.
The best thing you can do if you don't want to have the drive pulled is check the level frequently. If it does not go down then its all good. If it does you have to get it fixed because it will lead to low oil level (the oil will mostly wind up in the driveshaft bellows so you might not see it). You trailer your boat, right? Not left in the water? If so keep an eye on that level, if its good then you can keep using it.
You are going to get that drive serviced in the fall right?
Don't worry there is enough knowledge on this site and others (iboats is very good) to guide you through if you want to learn.
One thing about outdrive boats, if you don't do the maintenance, they will cost you big time sooner or later. I have to maintain it more or less like an airplane because in salt water there is no forgiveness.

Thinking it over again, I do think it came from where you think it did. Because, as long as you don't have a leak in the bellows, gear oil that leaks from the input shaft seal has to wind up in the bellows.

jontmiller · **Joined:** Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:16 am **Posts:** 296

LouC wrote:

I was replying on my phone and didn't see the reply from Ray, if you did spill some gear oil in that area last fall and did not tilt up the drive till now, its possible that it could have come from there. If you trim it down, then trim it up again and it continues leaking then you have to pull the drive and look at that seal.
The best thing you can do if you don't want to have the drive pulled is check the level frequently. If it does not go down then its all good. If it does you have to get it fixed because it will lead to low oil level (the oil will mostly wind up in the driveshaft bellows so you might not see it). You trailer your boat, right? Not left in the water? If so keep an eye on that level, if its good then you can keep using it.
You are going to get that drive serviced in the fall right?
Don't worry there is enough knowledge on this site and others (iboats is very good) to guide you through if you want to learn.
One thing about outdrive boats, if you don't do the maintenance, they will cost you big time sooner or later. I have to maintain it more or less like an airplane because in salt water there is no forgiveness.

Thinking it over again, I do think it came from where you think it did. Because, as long as you don't have a leak in the bellows, gear oil that leaks from the input shaft seal has to wind up in the bellows.

Thanks for your input, funny you mention airplanes...I fly them for a living and its a good thing I am not an aviation mechanic.

Initially I thought it was the bellows because that's where the drop was from, upon further look that was just the lowest drip point.

IF I can see any oil...do you think it would be clean or dirty? This stuff looked brand new.

The boat has dock space now so its kind of a pain to pull it out, assume with great care I can check the level at the dock? Seems like a great way to lose stuff...

Thanks for you, Ray and everyone taking the time to look at these posts.., your an asset to the forum and I appreciate your time answering our amateur hour questions

photo.JPG by millerjont, on Flickr

LouC · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 8:22 pm

Seeing as how it was just changed, it would likely be clean...When I change mine after a whole season, its nearly as clean as it went in. I think if you even let it sit a few days with the drive down, then trim it up again, you might be able to judge if you are losing anything. The thing with gear oil is that an outdrive is very expensive to rebuild especially a Volvo, so that is something you want to be sure about. I had my Cobra re-sealed twice when I first got it 12 years ago and since then I have not had to do anything to it besides gear oil changes, anode changes and salt water maintenance. But if I let those little problems go on it would have never lasted this long.

ric · **Posted:** Thu May 15, 2014 9:21 pm

Well, my vessel is on the trailer as of an hour ago parked in front of my house. Tomorrow after work going to acid wash the hull and get all the lake crap off and give it a good wash. Saturday bring it to the marina!!!! Next week after work I'll be going down to the marina and giving it a high speed buff every couple of days until it's glossy and new.

Most of the maintenance is done. Everything but drive oil and water pump. I'll do that at the marina in the next couple of weeks. I'm freaking excited!!! Finally I'll be USING my boat and not just idling around a pond.

SteveinLA · **Joined:** Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:04 am **Posts:** 50

Hi guys! I am always so pleased when I post something that is of interest to others. I enjoy reading the questions of others. I appreciate the great answers that are posted in response. Thank you.

I went to my local lake Thursday; Castaic Lake here in L.A. County. The lake is down at least 20'. I knew it was bad, but seeing it really brought home the severity of this drought. I knew there was something wrong when I went to launch my boat and it didn't want to float off of the trailer. Later when I went to recover my boat, I discovered that my trailer was sitting on a sand bar that prevented it from going deep enough to allow the boat back onto the trailer. Hmm. I found myself moving the trailer several times to find a place where wasn't as much sand. I called the office and requested they clear the ramp. We'll see what it is like next week.

My boat ran well for the most part. I love this FW Stable V hull. WooHoo! My kids enjoyed being drug behind the boat in the inner tube. It looks like abuse to me, but they enjoy it. I brought plenty of sandwiches, cookies, water, and bread to feed the ducks. OK, duck. We only saw one. It was a well fed duck. It was good.

My fuel injected 302 did have some problems starting several times. I'm not sure, but I think it is a fuel delivery problem. I found my self opening the throttle to get it started. Should I have to do that with an EFI engine?

Thanks again for all the great responses to mine and others questions and comments.

R, Steve

Surface Interval · **Posted:** Sat May 17, 2014 5:38 am

Steve, my '95 190 with that engine rarely had any problem starting. On occasion when the weather was in the 90s and I had stopped for 10-20 minutes, it may have experienced fuel line vapor lock. This was due to the engine compartment temp increasing after the engine was shut down after being worked pulling tubes or skiers. An engine at operating temp being shut down will still give off heat. No ventilation may cause fuel in fuel lines to evaporate. You might turn on the blower in the engine compartment to help reduce temp.

Otherwise, is there a chance you have bad fuel? Old fuel? Or maybe some water in the system? The center section of the floor can be removed to get to the tank, if needed. Change the fuel filter on the front of the engine, or at least pull it and pour it in to a container to look for contamination. Check/clean the spark arrester. It seems to collect lint, etc. Hope this helps.

ric · **Posted:** Sat May 17, 2014 6:52 am

Today's the big day! I have a few lose ends to tie up and it's off to the marina!

www.iFourWinns.com

Lake Prep 2014 -- Share Your Prep & Ask Questions

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