www.iFourWinns.com

Well, now, that depends on how soon we see pictures

_________________


Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

Well I went to pickup the boat and here I am home with no boat.

When I first saw the boat i was not impressed, something just didnt look right.

We went through the boat found a few rubber trim moldings on the windows that were pulled or sloppily cut. The carpet was out because it was still wet from being cleaned. The more I looked the more I just started thinking what a crappy cleaning job inside and outside, how did this boat get so dirty. Back on the outside i just started seeing too many scuffs and scratches in the gel coat and lots and lost of swirls like repeated buffing. All the swirls make the gelcoat more dull then it should have been.

So then i asked was this a boat show boat, and it became all too apparent it was. I told them I didnt want a boat show boat and never signed up to that. So they said cause the paper works already filled out that its to late but they will buff and give me a few hundred dollar gift certificate for their store.

Hell a boat show boat is like 10 years of handling to interior and gelcoat in human contact areas.

I had to walk away before I blew up - I was about to tell them to take and keep the boat all together w/ no replacement.


AHHHHHHH.

_________________
2008 H210:
- Two tone Navy Blue, Silver and Yellow
- 5.0GXi/SX 270hp
2006 Dodge Ram 3500 4x4 5.9 Laramie

Wow...i'd be pissed! Did you sign the paperwork on an already existing boat without seeing the boat?? By already existing I mean it was not a boat you had ordered and built to your specs.

_________________
2007 Four Winns 220SS (Sold!!)
2006 Toyota Tacoma

+1

I can't believe they tried to pass it off, I wouldn't consider a show boat as new. I would think it was like buying from their inventory where there is more flexibility in price than a couple hundred.

I think I may have walked. Sorry for your bad experience, keep us posted on what happens.

_________________
-Rob.


Current boat: 2011 Yamaha AR210
Previous boat: 1998 Horizon RX 4.3GL SX

I was in your boat at the Grand Rapids show. I had dark soled shoes with salt stuck in the treads. I slammed the door to the glove box 25 times. My kids were pushing and pulling on everything. Sorry about the wire I think I pulled loose when I dropped my beer in the bow. I wondered why the wire was dangleing.

Honestly, I'd tell the dealer to shove it. You purchased a NEW boat. Not a show boat. That boat has been trailered all over the mid-west in the snow, salt, sand, and winter grime. NO WAY. Want to bet the trailer has a coat of rust on it?

Don't take delivery. Find a new dealer if need be.

_________________
2001 Horizon 260 - 7.4 Volvo GSI DP

Same here, I would have lost it! There is no way that your boat should have been put in a boat show without your knowledge..... without you having been asked.

I am no legal expert, but I would think that you have grounds for breaking out of your contract. The boat is no longer a brand new boat... even though the engine might not have hours it has been exposed to wear and tear (just as you said c5er).

Sorry to hear about your poor experience. Today should have been a much more exciting day for you than this!

_________________
2009 H180 w/3.0 Merc
Homebuilt Minimax Hydro
2011 Zodiac Cadet 310

The first thing I'd do is get in front of the sales manager or owner of the dealership.

A boat show boat is no different than a demo boat. Personally, you had better be getting 40% off msrp (yes, i am serious) on a demo or boat show boat. Tell them you might as well buy a used boat.

That being said - hopefully you have a signed purchase/sale agreement with the dealership and you can get on their butts about breach of contract -- let alone lying to you.

If I were you- I would demand a refund of every penny you have given them and walk away. Find a new dealer. Unless they start begging for forgiveness and apologizing for lying to you!

If they want your business - they will apologize and offer to ORDER you a new boat with some extra options thrown in (start making a list). Same price, same deal - just more options for your "inconvenience". If they say no, walk away.

I noticed you are in Wisconsin. You have tons of other dealers in the Michigan area... and if you want to go a bit farther, I can point you where I had a fantastic experience (Northeast area of the country - best price top noth customer service... even if I am 3000 miles from the shop).

There is no easy "we'll make it right" on a boat show boat... unless they sell it to you for 40% off MSRP as I mentioned above.

Don't take this crap from them. It's so not worth it. This was not an "oops". This was a deliberate decision by the dealer to maximize profits.

FYI - dealers get extra manufacturer discounts for their "boat show boats".

_________________

2008 318 Vista -SOLD, but I am still around!
All Night Long, Seattle WA

If you need a name and a marina in Michigan, call Jim Rigby at Hall's Marina in Muskegon. He will treat you right.

_________________
2001 Horizon 260 - 7.4 Volvo GSI DP

Went back in to talk to the dealer to tell them I didnt want the boat used at the boat show. They had already clean a section of the red, and it did look much better, but still no like new.

Apparently it was only used at one boat show. They are hung up on the semantics that its not demo'd or used because its not been in the water, and that one show would'nt do anything...

I talked to a dealer in IL and MI, and both dealers said they would need to disclose that the boat was used at a show.

I told them I would like new, but I would consider the boat if it was cleaned up even better then the test section they had just done and there was substantial savings over what I paid.

At 500 bucks off in gift certificate money i would rather have new.

_________________
2008 H210:
- Two tone Navy Blue, Silver and Yellow
- 5.0GXi/SX 270hp
2006 Dodge Ram 3500 4x4 5.9 Laramie

c5er,

I don't think any of us are surprised to hear that the dealer "didn't think it'd be a big deal" -- but that's not the point. THe point is that they sold you a NEW, NEVER used, NEVER been open to the public to track crud and break stuff.

I dont know if you want to disclose the price you had agreed to pay vs MSRP... but I agree that a 500 dollar in store credit for full retail accessories isn't really much of a discount.

If they are treating you like "it's no big deal" when they conveniently forget to ask you if they could use your boat in a show -- then do you really think you can trust them to service your boat? Is this a dealer you really want to maintain a long term relationship with?

Mistakes always happen - but having a dealer either use your boat without telling you OR buying a boat show boat to sell to you as new -- neither of those jive in the old honesty department.

And I say again... as far as I know - dealers can either move boats from to show to show or are on loan from FW... those dealers have a chance to purchase that boat from FW at a discount from what they would have normally paid. Ex. my local dealer had an 07 260 that was in the 2007 brochure (the white one with an arch) -- they told me that because the boat was a marketing/photo boat - they got it for a discount and could therefore pass on that 10% off MSRP to me! Like it was such a great deal! When in fact, they probably had a 45% profit margin in the boat over their probable 35% margin on a new 260!

I would expect your 210 to have at LEAST a 30% margin on a new boat order... and probably an additional 10% if it was a boat show boat. Of course, if it was a dealers decision to take a new stock boat and put it in a show - well, that's their own stupidity. Sell the boat as a boat show boat and not a new custom order boat.

It was these kind of antics during my sales experience locally that pushed me to go outside my region to find a great dealer to work with. I feel your pain.

_________________

2008 318 Vista -SOLD, but I am still around!
All Night Long, Seattle WA

One other note... if they can clean up that boat to your liking... and you do want to go forward with purchasing that boat.... for whatever reason. I would avoid the "gift certificate" thing and have them 1) Discount the price of the boat 2) Throw in an extended Warranty for free 3) Make a list of anything and everything that you could/would possibly need or want and have them include all of that in the sale.

If the costmetic stuff really is just fine when it's all said and done and there really are zero hours on the boat - it's a great chance for you to get an even better deal.

Just to throw it out there...

1) Shoot for a boat purchase price that is 30% of MSRP
2) Throw in the Volvo 2+4 with zero deductible as part of the purchase price (dealer cost is probably around 750 bucks)
3) You want a full 20 hour service thrown in. You also want a full winterization/oil change/drive oil change/ antifreeze winterize thrown in. (Cheap for the dealer to do) - Get these IOU's in writing.
3) Make a ginormous list of everything you want thrown in. Remember accessories have big mark up (50-100%) - Great for you, great for the dealer

THings like:

1) Safety gear -- flares, float cusion, fire extinguisher, paddle, boat hook, etc
2) Life vests -- how many do you need? What kind do you REALLY want?
3) Ropes, fenderes, anchor, chain, anchor line
4) Towing cover from Four Winns (probably 500 bucks)
5) towables, wakeboards, tow ropes, etc.


Remember -- you are in the power position. Your worst case scenario is that you go find another dealer. If they don't already get that, feel free to remind them.

_________________

2008 318 Vista -SOLD, but I am still around!
All Night Long, Seattle WA

What an absolute load of horse***t. That $500 is nothing. Seriously, I'd tell him what he can do with his boat, and go find a different dealer. If you act quickly, there should still be time to get a boat built and delivered for a full season. This is not an oversight, it's (at best) unethical and (at worst) a violation of FW's dealer rules. To me this would be a sign of the relationship to come with this dealer, and I'd want NOTHING to do with it. If you have to fight and coerce this dealer to do the right thing on the most basic of tasks (selling you what you agreed to buy), do you trust him to do service properly and handle warranty issues as you expect? All dealers need to be watched closely, but NOT all of them do rotten things like this.

I'm very sorry to hear this, it must be frustrating beyond words.

_________________


Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

I can't say it hasnt crossed my mind, can i trust them with the replacement boat. Is it possible that they would do something just to mess with me?

I was just talking with a friend that work for boat dealers for a number of years, he was saying even one boat show is murder on these things. His thoughts were all the traffic adds alot of stress to things, and you find a year or so latter that cushion seems are letting go and buttons dont work. Then when it goes in for warranty - the dealer looks at the issue says this shouldnt have broken with this few hours on it - you abused it - warranty denied. Plus there nothing like having the boat sit at a dealer for 3 weeks in the middle of summer when its broke.

_________________
2008 H210:
- Two tone Navy Blue, Silver and Yellow
- 5.0GXi/SX 270hp
2006 Dodge Ram 3500 4x4 5.9 Laramie

c5er --I PM'd you some info... check it out.

There is plenty of time to order a boat and have it in April still... just need to get it ordered ASAP.

Also - the Four Winns rebates for boat shows end at that end of March...

Get your orders in everyone! ha ha ha ha.

_________________

2008 318 Vista -SOLD, but I am still around!
All Night Long, Seattle WA

Don't let your frustration talk you into accepting something less than what you paid for, especially from a liar. You don't buy a boat every week - you deserve to have it be right!

I didn't order our boat until the first week of March, and we took a water delivery on June 2nd. Getting one matching your specifications transferred from another dealer's stock may also be an option, but I wouldn't even do THAT through the dealer that did this to you.

Also, I would call FW directly Monday morning and let them know in very clear terms how you feel about this experience. FW has dropped dealers over stuff like this, it does serious damage to their reputation and they know it. Such a call might (I can't say for sure) have some bearing on being able to get a boat built quickly and delivered through a different dealer. You DO have options here...

_________________


Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic