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Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
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Author:  LakeMonsterSS [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 2:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
Posted in the Audio forum and not a single response..

Guys, I flat out desire a higher quality sound than what I am getting right now out of my stock system. Currently have a 2008 H210SS with the Sony 6.5 speakers and the MTX TM1004 Thunder sub. I don't know much about the speakers other than the fact they suck, and rattle at higher volumes. The sub is designed for infinite baffle operation even though it is mounted in what looks like a sealed enclosure under the starboard back seat. I have already upgraded from the Kicker amp to a JL M700/5 and now am ready for speakers. Here is my dilemma, JL speakers I can get a killer deal on whether I decide the Mx650/M650/M770 but I have also really been liking what I read about the Polk MM651/MM651UM speakers. The subs I am contemplating are the matching subs for each of those setups (JL M10W5 or Polk MM1040), I would prefer to move to a non-infinite baffle design as my research has turned up they have "crisper" bass.

Someone, please help me out! Has anyone listened to both of these speakers? Quality comparisons? Which model should I am for? Take the $$ out of the equation with the suggestions.
Thanks in advance,
Stephan
Author:  Paul I. [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
Speakers, I like Blaupunkt & Rockford. But thats me, I bought one pair of each and installed them in the cockpit. It is very good blend, The best out of both brands.
Author:  fi.na.tine [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 12:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
You probably want a new head unit to start. The head unit (unless replaced recently) is 6 years old. Afterwards - build your system around it. If you don't start with the head unit, you will be miserable down the road.

It sounds like you want Crisp bass - Go with the polk for speakers. JL is a good brand, but Polk is better IMHO.
Author:  Jake [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 8:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
I replaced the stock speakers in my 14 H210 with the Polk MM651 and added a Polk PA D4000.4 amp. I am very impressed with the sound, crisp and full. Low end is very good from these speakers, considering adding a sub, but happy with the sound as is for now. I did listen to the JL, they were good as well, cost was the deciding factor.
Author:  kd4pbs [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 9:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
As you know, speakers depend greatly on the environment they are in. What sounds good to me in my Vista (Rockford Fosgate speakers all around) won't sound the same in your boat. Hopefully some people with the exact same boat and exact same setup can give you direction.
Author:  240 Joe [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 7:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
I replaced (by professional) the Clarion system on my 2006 H240 with cockpit WetSounds speakers, Rev10 inch tower speakers, WetSounds amp for the tower, Kicker amp for the 4 cockpit speakers, but left the Clarion head unit and subwoofer in place upon the WetSound dealer recommendation. Very happy with the results.
Author:  Paul I. [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
I would look at the Fusion marine head unit. A true marine head with options that some just don't have.
Author:  atlmover [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 7:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
I just recently did a complete stereo upgrage in my 220. I opted for JL audio speakers with a new head unit as well. I6.5 speakers up front (previously 5.5) and new speakers throughout. And a JL 10. All marine equipment. It sounds incredible. I share a workspace with a local radio shop. They swear by JL. I have to say I couldn't imagine it could get much better.
Author:  ric [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 8:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
Fusion stereos have horrible sound quality that's well documented. Go with something quality like Alpine or Kenwood. I prefer Kenwood because their "auto" stereos have water protection and work with the kenwood wired marine remotes.

Speakers? Polk MM series powered by an amp
Sub? Something in a sealed enclosure. 10" sound great. Powered by another amp that you can turn off.

I'm going to do a speaker/sound upgrade myself. Clarion 4 channel amp powering MM651's. I already have a Kenwood KDC-x597 head unit.
Author:  Paul I. [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 9:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
ric wrote:
Fusion stereos have horrible sound quality that's well documented. Go with something quality like Alpine or Kenwood. I prefer Kenwood because their "auto" stereos have water protection and work with the kenwood wired marine remotes.

Speakers? Polk MM series powered by an amp
Sub? Something in a sealed enclosure. 10" sound great. Powered by another amp that you can turn off.

I'm going to do a speaker/sound upgrade myself. Clarion 4 channel amp powering MM651's. I already have a Kenwood KDC-x597 head unit.


I totally DISAGREE with Ric on the Fusion head. If he owned one, than he would know.

I own one and I am a music nut when it come to this stuff. Its DAC (digital to analog converter) is far better than most home units. And its features far out-weigh Sony & Clarion that I have had in the past. Just compare specs. The bigger the boat, the more you will like it because it has "zones" that you can control, that no other deck has. So I turn it up in the cockpit and the wife in the cabin is not yelling at me. Out of the box, it has 4 zones/rooms that can be controlled independently of each other.
Author:  kd4pbs [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 10:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
Kenwood units have that zone control too, as well as Sony, Clarion, Spark-O-Matic, ElCheapo Decko, and every other 4-speaker deck I've ever seen. They just refer to it in the standard convention called "fader". I haven't listened to a fusion, so I can't comment on the audio quality.
I second a Kenwood unit, for the reasons Ric stated. Unless you can't mount the unit behind a waterproof panel and can't fit it in one of the marine 1-DIN waterproof face covers, in which case your only choice would be a sealed unit.
Author:  Paul I. [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
kd4pbs wrote:
Kenwood units have that zone control too, as well as Sony, Clarion, Spark-O-Matic, ElCheapo Deck, and every other 4-speaker deck I've ever seen. They just refer to it in the standard convention called "fader". I haven't listened to a fusion, so I can't comment on the audio quality.
I second a Kenwood unit, for the reasons Ric stated. Unless you can't mount the unit behind a waterproof panel and can't fit it in one of the marine 1-DIN waterproof face covers, in which case your only choice would be a sealed unit.


No, this is not the fade control. You can program the remote in that area to control that zone.

From the manual, better then typing:

ZONES
Zone 1 and 2 are powered by the on board Class-D amplifier. External
amplifiers are required to utilize the 4 line outputs and 4 subwoofer outputs.
You can pre-set the balance, volume limit, sub-woofer level and name for each
of the four Zones available on the 700 Series. If required, you can also:

• Enable or disable Zones 2, 3 and 4 (Zone 1 is always enabled).
• Enable or disable volume control (Zones 3 and 4 only).
• Link Zones 1 and 2.

No need for waterproof cover, its IPx5 waterproof rated.

http://www.panbo.com/archives/2011/10/f ... kerel.html
Author:  ric [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 11:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
I zone control all the time in my cuddy. It's called fader.
Author:  Paul I. [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 12:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
ric wrote:
I zone control all the time in my cuddy. It's called fader.


So if you turn up the volume and the volume alone. It will not afect the other 2 speakers? Of course it will. Not so with Fusion. Your not doing your home work. BUT, on smaller boats, Fusion could be overkill due to what it has to offer over the rest.
Author:  Jdpber [ Thu Aug 21, 2014 12:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Full Stereo upgrade - Dilemma
ok one feature of INDIVIDUAL zone control does not make a HU better than the other.. YOU are asking OPINIONATED questions and everyone is instilled to their opinion..

Now i will say this the lower end Fusion units are junk. you have to get into the 600 and 700 series for OK sound. it is not what a MOSFET processor will produce better cross frequency audio reproduction.. Now the fusion is not horrible and not the worst thing on the market.. BUT i repeat BUT for the same money you can get a vastly larger selection of Head hunts that out perform the Fusion on features and sound quality along with inputs and outputs.


For starters your Sony speakers are JUNK! end of story, and that sub is JUNK it was a sales ploy but he manufacture,. it sounds nice in a show room but outside you may as well un plug it..

To get things started you first need to make a budget.. If you only have $400 not a ton of improvements will be made. If you have $600-900 you can have a jam up stereo if you do the install yourself and find some sales..

Next decide how much you want to spend on the speakers and what you want.. I personally have Polk MM651 2 pairs in my boat in an amp feeding them plenty of power and they flat out blast!

Decisde on a nice sub. you do not have to got with a marine specific sub if the cone and seal are both plastic.. the foam coan and seals will dry rot in a boat. you can build a simple sealed box for your space and lay 2 layers of 9oz glass over it and it is water tight for life.In addition it will be rock hard audio reproduction with a nice sub. I would not go less than a 10" a 10"-12" is nice for a boat.. (i have a 10" in the stern and a 12" under the dash..

Ok Next you will need a 4 channel amp or a 6 channel depending on how many high/mid speakers that you choose for the vocals and instrumentals. then you need an amp dedicated to the Sub,. they do make 6ch amp designed to bridge 5/6 for the sub and this is an option but they tend to demand a decent $$ for nice stable output. BUT this is a good space saver for a boat..


just remember the quoted 50x4 watt output that the head units claim never stand up to 50 watts from a dedicated amp. the polks desire more than 50 to make them truly shine. I will let you do the specs on the speakers but you need to match the amps to the RMS of the speakers for optimal output..

If you do this I am sure you will not be disappointed when on the hook or under power cruising.


ASK AWAY WE WILL HELP.


also members lets remember this is not meant to be an argument over individuals opinions.. and everyone thinks that their best speakers are the best until they hear something better. i mean i listen to studio monitors at the office in a sound stable old recording booth.. (out office used to be the radio station) and i feel that i have a very good ear being in the car audio and home audio area for many years..

BUT again everyones ears are different and preferences are diff..


I will say this for the cost of the 600 and 700 fusion you can get a HU with remote for the transom for the same money.
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