www.iFourWinns.com

Hello all,

I'm getting some blisters on my dash between the vinyl and the substrate underneath. My guess is the glue is failing and its reacting with something, causing pockets of gas/air. The bubbles range in size from a penny to a hockey puck and it's starting to look like my boat is diseased. Do you have any ideas of the best way to get rid of them?

Here are my thought:
Slide in a hypodermic needle and suck ther air out. Once empty, inject some glue. Not sure what kind of glue though. Suggestions?

Instead of injecting with glue, maybe heat with a hair dryer and re-set?

Thanks all.

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2000 Horizon 230

What year/model Horizon? Have you contacted FW Customer service? Got any pics?

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2007 Horizon 200
4.3L GXi/ SX 225 HP

Since it's a 2000 H230, I don't think warranty is going to help but I guess I could give them a call. I've got no pics at the moment.

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2000 Horizon 230

Well, you never know. FW Customer service has helped out others with defects outside of warranty. Even without coverage, they may have seen this before and can recommend a course of action.

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2007 Horizon 200
4.3L GXi/ SX 225 HP

Thanks Jim. I'll check into it. Do you think they would help the second owner of the boat?

Anyone else have a "Plan B" if Four Winns denies?

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2000 Horizon 230

Buy a new vinyl dash section? I priced out replacing a stern hatch on my boat, and the price was a lot less than I was expecting.

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2007 358 T-5.7GXi IB
Previous Boats
'08 H240, '08 V318, '04 268, '04 225

I had the same thing on the right hand dash on my 2003 240H when I purchased it. Since I still had a month or two of warranty left, Four Winns replaced it at the local dealer at their cost. Unfortunately the dealer messed up all the electric connections in the dash during the install and I am still fighting that. (I have not been back to them since that time) -- and the new dash (replaced a little over two years ago) is now just as bad as the first one. Good luck is all I can say.

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DaleG -- West Palm Beach FL
2003 240Horizon -- 5.7Gi -Duoprop

I have a few small ones on the head side. I just keep putting 303 on and try to limit the sun exposure (putting the cover on) to try and limit them getting any worse. I really do not see how it would be possible to suck the air out. I think you could add adhesive in there. My fear is that you would be stuck with a bunch of little bubbles. I would be afraid you could not smooth it out as the vinyl has already expanded.

A lot of work, but if you can get access top the underside (probably means removing the dash) your could consider drilling small holes ( ca 1mm diameter) through the thermformed carrier, not actually piercing the vinyl covering then compressing the top vinyl back down pushing out the air. The only safe way to drill such holes is to put a stop of some sort on the drill bit, or else there's a severe risk of going through the coverstock. The holes in the substrate should not witness through to the coverstock due to the grain. First of all trying to heat reactivate the glue that's in there, for flat areas, you could use a warm clothes iron, with a suitable protective cloth ( in case you smooth away the grain!), if this works it should be virtually invisible. For the larger blisters, it should be easy do decide where to drill; for smaller ones, less so,

As a last resort injecting in some glue and pushing the excess glue through the holes underneath; but which glue? The problem is getting rid of all the solvents without a risk of causing a blister when it gets hot in service! Originally it would probably have been made with a vacuum formed skin with a heat activated adhesive on either the carrier or the coverstock, (in which case the method above might well work!). One production method is to have holes in the carrier, mount it on a box and a skin in a frame put on top; IR heat applied to the skin, vacuum is applied to the underside of the carrier, the hot skin is pulled down onto the carrier and the heat activates the adhesive. If this method was used originally, the vacuum holes may even already be there! However, they would not necessarily be where the blisters are unfortunately.

Graham

Excellent thoughts Graham. I've looked to see what kind of accessibility I had underneath to drill. Not much there. I'll need to remove the whole dash to do it right.

I just checked a replacement cost for the port and starboard side - $2,000. No thanks.

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2000 Horizon 230

$2000 !! I bet you could get both original armatures custom covered in hand stitched leather for less than that!

A thought; the armature is also probably vacuum formed, possibly with plug assist. You need to be aware that the original material was a flat sheet with consistent thickness, but the thickess in the final armature will depend on the degree of draw; in regions of high draw, basically deep sections at right angles to the original sheet, it will be very much thinner than it started off. So you need to take care when drilling the holes!

Graham

Just wanted to post an update to my blistering problem. I used a small gauge syringe to poke into the bubble and suck the air out. Works like a champ. It takes a couple times for some of the holes as they blister back up but I’ve been able to correct nearly all of them the first try. Have not used any heat to reactivate the adhesive yet. We’ll see if my solution is a long term answer first.

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2000 Horizon 230

Please post further updates. I have one blister that occasionally shows up. In my case, getting it out in the sun makes it disappear. I've considered using one syringe to inject some adhesive into it, and another to then suck the air out.

Or, I could just use the boat more.

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Mike
2005 Four Winns 230/240
VP 5.7GXi/DP
1998 F-150 XLT
Boat Pic

cnst,
that is awesome that you got them out!!! I am going to have to do the same thing with my dash. Keep me posted if you find an adhesive that works or maybe it wont be needed. I will post some pics of mine. DREW

Well tried the needle and it worked well. There are just a few spots that i might have to spend some more time on. What do you guys think? It took out 80% of the blisters. I have alot of bubbles/blisters but it looks ten times better!!! There are still some i couldn't get out. I will just need to spend more time i will keep everyone updated DREW
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