New four winns 170 horizon owner

theoriginalgiga · **Joined:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:47 am **Posts:** 26

Hi all, i'm a proud new owner of a 1989 four winns 170 Horizon open bow with a 4.3L v6 OMC drive but with no outdrive. It's my first boat and I was able to pick it up as a project for $300 including trailer. The major parts of the project is rebuilding the engine as it's seized and has water in the oil, but it did sit without an engine cover and no air filter through the rains this year. Getting an out drive put onto it as well as interior work. The floor is sturdy, clean hull and the electrical works. My questions are:

1) seeing as the engine is a 4.3L v6 I believe it's based off of chevy's 4.3L engine, can I use a chevy 4.3L rebuild kit on it or do I have to buy a special OMC rebuild kit, and if so where would I find one?
2) my uncle and the guy I bought the boat from said to forget the OMC out drive, glass up the back of the boat and put on a volvo penta out drive. Should I spend my time looking for the OMC out drive or follow the advice of my uncle and the guy I bought my boat from or does anyone have any better suggestions?

All things being equal, I'm looking for something that's durable, going to last a while and is relatively low maintenance and can easily find replacement parts for. I plan on using the boat for camping and skiing, not much of a fisherman. I'm not worried about glassing up the back of the transom as I have a friend who does it professionally, I can rebuild an engine and my girlfriend is a godsend when it comes to a sewing machine

.

Thanks for looking!

230 Mike · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:21 pm

Your uncle may be absolutely right on this one. It sounds to me like the seller made you an honest deal considering the amount of work it will probably need. At this point I would not spend a lot of energy or money chasing OMC parts. But before you go any farther, I'd have a very close look at the condition of the floor. You may have structural issues in addition to the whole drive train being shot.

Still, it looks like a nice boat that has been somewhat cared for, but I have a feeling you're about to put serious money into it. You can get used or rebuilt drives (eBay etc.), but be careful about cheaping out too much; it's a good way to spend your afternoons stranded and waiting on a tow.

The trailer appears to be in surprisingly good condition for its age. I'd bet it's overdue for new tires though, and a careful inspection of the bunks and carpet is in order.

Welcome to the forum, in any case. Where has this boat spent it's life, and where do you plan to use it?

theoriginalgiga · **Joined:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:47 am **Posts:** 26

thanks for the reply

freshwater seems to be the way I'll probably use it. Lakes in northern California, in Iselton CA if I get back down there. I miss getting out on the water and haven't been camping in years.

Another question and this seems a little far fetched. My co-worker made mention of using a water jet setup instead of an outdrive. It would be a lot more work, but does anyone have experience with these conversions?

But before any converting can take place, it'll be all about getting the boat gutted and looking at really is going on with it and what needs to be fixed.

Thanks for the recommendation of looking at the floor. it feels solid under my feet and I'm a big guy, but I'm still going to inspect it to see what's going on with it.

Also any thoughts on the engine? would a rebuild kit for a 4.3 chevy work?

ric · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:16 pm

Yes, it's a non-vortec GM 4.3. You can use a standard rebuild kit.

I would just search for a complete engine/outdrive package. For example:
http://stlouis.craigslist.org/boa/2908557701.html

Otherwise, you're not stuck to OMC. With a little bit of fiberglass work you can put anything in there. You can find complete working Mercruiser engine packages for under $1000 used off craigslist.

To be honest, it will cost you more to fix that boat in good condition then to just buy a mid 90s bowrider in perfect working order.

LouC · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 2:48 pm

That boat can be converted to a merc alpha or a Volvo SX with no glass work, they all used the same cut out. Merc is cheaper and easier to find. It could be done easily with used parts. Id remove the seats, rip up that carpet and carefully check the whole structure for rot......

If pulling the engine, I might not bother with the SEI conversion to mount the Alpha to the Cobra transom mount, I'd get a used Alpha transom mount complete with the tilt cylinders and pump. While you have it off check the whole transom to make sure its solid.

If the structure is good start collecting parts for the conversion. It's going to cost a bit but you will be starting out in good shape with a boat that should run well for years. I still have the Cobra on mine but when I do re-power it I may convert it at that time. Right now my Cobra stuff is still in very good shape esp for the years of use in salt water. Personally I feel the Cobra when properly set up is superior to the Alpha but if you can't get parts it doesn't matter. The Cobra has bigger gears, holds more oil, and is easier to change the bellows by far. But the shift linkage is harder to adjust, I now have all 3 of the special tools OMC sold to make it easier so I may just stick with it. Mine shifts great and is very quiet.

theoriginalgiga · **Joined:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:47 am **Posts:** 26

Thanks for all the input. I've been searching online for conversion kits because I know I'm not the first to want to do this conversion (don't tell my boss :lol:

) I think I'm leaning towards the Mercruiser conversion as it seems to be easier and cheaper to get. I mean heck I found an entire conversion kit 1900 otd with a brand new alpha 1 gen II like these two links.
http://www.crowleymarine.com/Stern-Driv ... ha_Kit.cfm
http://www.boatstoreonline.com/OMC_conversion.html

Now I don't know if that's a good outdrive. Are there any outdrives that I should stay away from? I have the 4.3L engine and I'm slightly worried about picking up a random outdrive and my obliterating it under the power of the engine, are there any markings, name tags, pretty colors I need to look for when picking out an outdrive? Is there the holy grail of outdrives? I mean if I see it for $300 to pick it up and never let go of it?

I'm sorry for all the stupid questions. Again it's my first boat and I did a lot of research on boats before getting one, but apparently not enough.

Thanks again for all your helpful posts.

230 Mike · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:10 pm

No such thing as a stupid question.

ric · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:20 pm

Just browse craigslist. With some searching, I bet you could have a complete V8 merc setup for under $1000 (engine, outdrive). Heck, it might even come with another boat

That 4.3 with DP is a steal. You would do wheelies on the water with a H170.

theoriginalgiga · **Joined:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:47 am **Posts:** 26

I did find one for 500, engine doesn't turn over, but no biggie I planed on rebuilding an engine anyway. The real question is how would this boat deal with the extra weight of a v8?

ric · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 5:08 pm

really doesn't weigh any more. no different then having a passenger sit in the rear seat

LouC · **Posted:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:06 pm

the V-8s only going to add about 100 lbs max, but keep in mind that if you keep the Cobra transom mount, you have the V-6 Y pipe for the exhaust, the V-8 exhaust risers may come in at different angle and the engine is about 3.5 in longer, so your engine box may not fit. That boat was not sold with a V-8. I'd stick with the V-6, you will have to change the front engine mounts, the exhaust may not line up and the outdrive gear ratio is different too (but does not matter because you are changing the drive to start). A good running V-6 4.3 with a 4 bbl carb will be more than enough power for that 17 footer.

theoriginalgiga · **Joined:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:47 am **Posts:** 26

I'm not too sure how much of the cobra system I want to keep. If I drop in a new engine, I'd probably scrap anything that was part of the old system, at the same time I do like the 4.3L engines. I've had 2 S10s with them and they're little firecrackers and good on gas too. I found a full rebuild kit for the 4.3L (car rebuild kit) for about 400 but that's with new rings and pistons so if those parts are good, I'm sure I can find a cheaper kit. At the same time I found someone in my area selling a 350 v8 with a mercruiser outdrive for 500. and the engine is running. I'm torn as I don't have a lot of cash in my pocket right now, but seems to be a good deal. I guess I could buy it, install the whole set and sell the OMC housing and engine to try to recoup some of the costs. In the end I want something that's built to last, that can pull a skiier and doesn't guzzle fuel faster than I can fill it up.

Again thanks for all the advice all!

*EDIT*

Well I called the guy and started to haggle with him, I figure that even if I don't use the V-8 and knowing the gearing is different in the upper of the mercruiser for the 4.3 and 5.7, I can use it as bartering power to get what I need for the boat. Ends up, he wanted to get rid of it more than he wanted the price, so I now have a chevy 350 5.7L and everything all the way back to the prop including the transom mounting plate. at the very least I can flip the engine to either a boat owner or a car enthusiast and make my cash back that I spent on the boat and engine set. I'm hoping to start tearing into it this weekend, getting everything out of it to look at the deck of the boat.

ardy · **Posted:** Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:08 am

Firstly welcome to the forum, and keep us posted with the progress, it's always an interesting read.

theoriginalgiga · **Joined:** Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:47 am **Posts:** 26

Ok, I now have the chevy 350 and the outdrive in my possession. this was a hot enough price that while my friend and I were removing the equipment (had to unbolt everything from the boat) the guy got 3 phone calls and I overheard one guy offering him 850 for the whole setup. I walked away with it for 360 (gave the guy an extra 10 for kicking over his coffee and breaking one of his bricks). Let me see if I can list all the parts I got:

Rebuilt 350 with headers, no carb
exhaust pipe to the stern drive
Mercruiser stern drive both top and bottom
shift plate
hydralic pump for the mercruiser, Transom bolt plate
alternator, thermostat housing, electric distruibtor cap, fuel filter, fuel separator and a few other odds and ends.
Bell housing to mate the mercruiser to the 350

The transom mounting plate needs to be blasted, it's aluminum and from my perspective doesn't look salvageable but my buddy says it is, we'll have to see.

One question. What would be the ramifications if I removed the bell housing on the 350 and mated it to my 4.3L and used the v-8 drive on my V-6? would I destroy the sterndrive?

Also Pictures!

And a good clear picture of the transom of my boat

ric · **Posted:** Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:59 am

The Alpha 1 stern drive can easily take 400+hp, especially in a tiny H170.

So.. to answer the question, no.. you won't damage it. Just get the alignment tool

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New four winns 170 horizon owner

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