www.iFourWinns.com

Bill, Sorry to hear about your bent shafts. Your post reminded me that I had that problem on the other shaft after my Wades Bay mishap. Your saving grace may be that most of that work around hear is done at Miller Island which is near your location.

I'm interested in your fuel burn issue, though, as it's been a persistent problem ever since I bought the boat in 2004. Four Winns had no knowledge of such a problem and the Mercury representative couldn't figure it out either. I first noticed it when the starboard tank always took more gas than the port. My generator feeds off the starboard tank so I thought that was the reason, but it was the same even when I didn't run the generator. I just lived with it until the bent strut incident, but that didn't fix it either. My trouble shooting was a little more detailed than just noticing how much gas it took to refill the tanks, though. My boat has the Mercruiser Smartcraft engine monitor system installed. This give me the real time fuel burn for each engine. By setting each engine to the same RPM's, I would see a difference in the fuel burn between engines. The starboard engine always burns more fuel than the port at equal RPM's. At 3800 RPM, the port engine burns about 16.5 gph and the starboard is 17.4 or more. The difference gets greater as the engine speed increases. As a check,I've tried balancing the fuel burn on the Smartcraft, but the RPM's between the engines is too great.

The only difference I can find between the two engines is that Four Winns runs both engines in the same direction and gets the counter-rotation in the gearboxes. Some manufacturers use a left hand/ right hand engine arrangement to achieve counter-rotation. FW runs both engines in the same direction but runs one gear box in forward and the other in reverse. These ZF transmissions have a different gear ratio in forward and reverse. It's not much different (1.48 in one direction, 1.52 in the other). I don't know if this slight difference is enough to cause up to a 20 gallon difference in fuel burn between the two tanks, but Sea Ray, with a similar arrangement actually has a 1/2'" difference in pitch between the port and starboard props to equalize the engine speeds.

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Jerry
2004 378 Vista "Escapade", T-Mercruiser 8.1 SHO
2003 Maxum 3300SE
1987 Wellcraft San Tropez
1991 Chaparral 2550SX
1987 Bayliner 2150
!967 Caravelle 1751

Interesting to read the gearbox ratio comment. Near as I can tell from having read the numbers on the prop collars I don't think they're different, other than rotation that is. I don't recall having the same difference in tank levels during past seasons. But I'll be checking the flow rate when it's back in the water. If the rates are the same then I'm either get bad tank level readings or gas is getting siphoned. I can't picture the guy next to me stealing gas. I'd be more inclined to question the accuracy of the tank sender (because that would be in keeping with the "one... more... thing..." plague.

So I'll have to run it a bit and refill afterwards, to get a better idea of what's going on. Might be a bit tedious but I'll top off, take a trip and then refuel comparing the refill amounts. I don't usually bother "filling" the tanks because of overflow risks. But for this I'll keep the gas absorbent towel handy.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

No such luck. The shaft was bent but capable of being straightened. Trouble is, the eff'ing prop place put the dealer on their last delivery stop. I thought I was clear when I told the dealer I'd go out of my way to pick it up myself as soon as it was ready. Can't blame them entirely as the prop place chose the delivery route. Still, annoys the hell out of me. So it's no boat this weekend, perhaps by next Tuesday. Grrrr.....

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

Jerry,
I absolutely concur with what SR does with their 8.1L engines in the 340 series for sure. I bent a prop and was surprised to find out that they were different sizes and turn in different directions.

I have engine synchs on my 358 and still the burn rate is slightly different, burning more on the starboard side and my gennie feeds off the port tank. The difference is pretty marginal over the course of the tank but I see it in my fuel flow meters. The difference is usually about a 1/2 a GPH to almost 1 gallon if I am not absolutely precise with the throttles which are digital and I run the synch always. Go figure.

I attribute this anomaly to the engines perhaps being trimmed slightly differently and perhaps my trim tabs being slightly different in pitch regardless of how I have them positioned and I also attribute this to how my boat sits in the water, leaning slightly to starboard, hence the issue with the shower never completely draining unless you manually move the water. Does this make sense or am I completely nuts in trying to rationalize a more serious issue?

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2008 Four Winns V358 (T 6.2L Merc Bravo III's with DTS and SeaCore)
2006 Sea Ray 340DA
2006 Sea Ray 320DA
2005 Maxum 3100 SE

No joy on the boat front. Seems the prop strut was also bent. That and it was bedded in 5200 and pulled out a chip of fiberglass when being removed. I do not want to start guessing who made that stupid eff'ing decision. What's done is done. I ran the strut up to Miller's Island myself to avoid any delays. Hopefully they'll have it ready to pickup ASAP. The sooner I get it back to the shop, the sooner they can get it reassembled.

What's more irritating is it'll need to sit overnight in the water so everything can settle properly before they do any final alignment. So it's not likely we'll have it back for the coming weekend. Suffice to say I'm less than pleased.

Some stuff just isn't noticeable until you start getting all the pieces (literally) straightened out. So the shaft bend (fixed) wasn't noticeable until after the cutlass bearing was replaced. Personally I think the strut bend was bad enough that it ought to have been noticed when removing the shaft. Had they noticed it then could have been straightened at the same time as the shaft. But it's too late to argue that point now.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

I think crabbers should be held liable someway for damage caused by their pots.... It's ridiculous up there crossing the Bay.

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Vic
"Byte Me"
1989 Vista 245
Lake Norman, NC

Don't see it happening. The industry is on the skids as it is, and not likely to have resources necessary to do it. A pot isn't cheap and losing one costs the waterman money (like around $50). They're as disinterested in losing them as much as boaters are about hitting them. Sure, some sort of ID number on the float and a tag on the trap would seem like a good idea. But neither would have helped me because there was no float and the trap fell off soon after coming up to hit the boat. All that was left on my running gear was a chunk of very deteriorated nylon rope. This is the usual outcome, so I'm told.

They have been running programs that compensate efforts to seek out and recover ghost traps. They're a blight on the fishing numbers because they trap and end up just killing a fair amount of creatures (beyond just crabs).

I'll just have to remember to adjust my course to seek deeper water. Won't be hard to do most of the time. And in hindsight I'd gladly trade the time saved for the amount of boating time lost.

Meanwhile it's like anything else, keep a sharp lookout and be prepared to file an insurance claim.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

Might need to add a line cutter

When I had to have my strut replaced, no one noticed the bend until it was sitting on a workbench to have the bearing replaced. It just happened to be sitting in such a way from a certain angle, the strut lined up with a corner of the mechanics toolbox against the wall behind the bench. It was pretty obvious then that it was bent, but just looking at it still on the boat, there is no point of reference to really tell it wasn't straight. Unfortunately, the strut went immediately to Miller Island for straightening and when the devlivery time was predicted to be too great, we ordered a new one from Four Winns. Well, the rebuilt one arrived the day after the new one arrived, so I now have a spare strut in the garage. Talk about a useless piece of metal....

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Jerry
2004 378 Vista "Escapade", T-Mercruiser 8.1 SHO
2003 Maxum 3300SE
1987 Wellcraft San Tropez
1991 Chaparral 2550SX
1987 Bayliner 2150
!967 Caravelle 1751

I could see that happening. I didn't notice it but then I wasn't looking.



Of course, now that you have a spare you'll never need that one!

Hopefully they'll have mine ready in a reasonable amount of time.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

Over here ....... you're likely to be held resposible for the loss of the trap and equipment, if you tangle with a lobster pot ... if anyone were to know about it.

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Gordon Arnold
New Hampshire

2003 268 Vista ..................................................................Prior: 97 245 Sundowner

I've heard things to that effect for lobster traps. But around here it seems they treat crabbing like some sort of half-assed redneck exercise. That and there's a fair amount of amateurs at it too, and they're often the culprits for nonsense like pots inside the channel markers. It seems the commercial crabbers have too much invested to see traps get lost due to that foolishness.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

Bill, all, I can relate on every level of this thread!
1. My port engine burns more fuel than my starboard, for no apparant reason.
2. In the last month my outdrives/boat have been completely covered with this furry/carpet-like growth...
3. I live on Thomas Point in Annapolis and the crab pots drive me crazy. Last weekend headed into the South river, they were inside the 'no-crab-pots' bouy lines, in the channel. What a pain. I have yet to wrap one up but I do feel for you. What a hassle this has been for you (I'm knocking on wood).

So, any idea what is causing this massive growth on the boats in the bay? Any easy way to get it off? My son went down for an hour last weekend (braving the jeelyfish no-less) and got some of it off with a stiff brush but said most of it stuck like it was glued on!

also, I'm a new boater... what strainer should I be checking for this growth?

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Stacy & Isora in Annapolis, MD
2005 Vista 298

Each engine has it's own strainer. Likewise there's one strainer each for the generator (if you have one) and for the air conditioner. My engine strainers are right near the engines themselves, in the engine compartment. The genset and AC strainers are in the cabin, underneath the cushions in the mid-cabin berth.

When checking strainers you have to CLOSE the sea cock for it FIRST. And if you're not opening/closing the sea strainers on a regular basis you'll want to be careful about operating their lever. It can tend to stick a bit. A slow steady pressure on the handle should work. What you want to avoid is pressing very hard against that lever and breaking the sea cock. On a new boat it's not very likely. But as boats age there's always the chance that the metal could get corroded and weaken. You don't want that happening and leaving you with a fountain of water coming into the boat. Slow, even pressure is good. This is why it's a good idea to operate the sea cocks regularly. You want them working smoothly and be able to know how to tell when they're not.

Anyway, close the sea cock then loosen the wingnuts on the top of the strainer (this assumes Perko strainers, Groco units require a spanner tool) to remove the top cover. Once that's off you can extract the strainer basket. Take it up on the pier and clean it using a hose. Also clean out the strainer itself. I use a kitchen sink bottle sponge just for the purpose. It doesn't have to be spotless, just free of debris. Any water that collects will get pumped out by the bilge pump. You can use a wet vac or towels otherwise. Reinstall the strainer basket and carefully replace the lid. The lid will probably have an O-ring inside it and you want to make sure that seats properly. Don't overtighten the lid because you don't want to deform the O-ring. Just snug it up to VERY finger-tight (no wrenches here).

I'm not sure what I'm going to do to avoid the growth that's accumulating this season. I'll probably have a diver come out a bit more often. What I do know about the growth is that you want to remove it BEFORE it hardens. If you pull the boat out you want to get that crap off there while it's still wet. Use a pressure washer, just not at full blast if it's a gas powered one. Just enough to know the gunk off, not etch into nearby bottom paint. I have a small electric residential-grade pressure washer that I might use to clean mine. I'll just dunk the pressure end of the wand down into the water to blast the tabs clean.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

Picked up the strut today at 2pm from Miller's Island and delivered it to the dealer doing the repairs. Got it to them in time for them to get some work done today. Fingers crossed for their having enough time to get it all put back together for the weekend.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista