www.iFourWinns.com :: View topic - Maiden Voyage, uhg!!

Well....I kinda sorta figured...that you'd be posting this...lol...
Anyway, been there done that. When I got my '88 H-200 in 2002, it would shift into fwd & rev, but would not shift from rev to neutral, without shutting off the engine. I took it to the best OMC shop around and they basically just removed the drive, cleaned out the crud that builds up behind the bell crank in the pivot housing (the part of the transom mount that the drive bolts on to) and adjusted the cable. It was fine, till about 2013 when the remote cable adjustment changed slightly and then it wouldn't fully engage rev. Most Cobra shift problems are a result of a sticky transom shift cable (needs to be replaced then), crudded up bell crank (easy fix) non functioning ESA (previous owners messing up OMC's nice design trying to make it work like the inferior Merc system) to high idle speed (should be no more than 600 rpm).
What to do.....
Well you can do a few tests on land first. Get someone up at the helm, to work the remote control for you. Put the drive down and level.
With the engine OFF spin the prop while they shift it from neutral to fwd, and neutral to rev. You should feel the prop lock in fully in each gear. If it ratchets then the adjustment of either the transom shift cable, or the remote cable is off.

To narrow it down, you can disconnect the transom shift cable at the bell crank on the engine (on your model it should be the lower of the 2 cables on the starboard side, the upper one in the slotted end of the bell crank is the remote cable). Now repeat this test, but shift it with the cable disconnected, and see if it locks in. If it does, then your remote cable adjustment is off. If not then you still have a transom cable/adjustment problem and the drive has to come off.
One other thing. If you run it in neutral and try to trigger the ESA (two little switches on the shifter assembly on the engine, the one with the metal lever on it triggers the ESA and should lower the idle). This is what allows the clutch dogs to release, so when you move the shifter to neutral, the fwd or rev gear actually releases and you get neutral. You need this to work because on the water, the force of the water against the prop and the way the gears and clutch dog is made, they will tend to stay engaged.

If the ESA does not stumble the idle, then you have to troubleshoot why.
If the drive is not shifting fully in to either gear, same thing.
Sounds to me like the drive has to come off.

Look at this:
http://www.midnight-wolf.com/OMC_Instal ... tions.html

Some models had the slotted end of the bell crank on the engine facing up, (mine) some had it facing down (earlier ones) pick the one that matches your boat. I know its confusing but read through it several times.

I'd pull off the drive and first measure the shift rod height. That has to be right. Then have someone turn the driveshaft clockwise and try to manually shift the drive from neutral to fwd and rev using the shift rod. Look at the prop shaft while you do this. Make sure it is turning the right way in fwd and rev. If it will not shift it has to go to a shop.
Next, look at the bell crank in the pivot housing, if its all crudded up behind the bell crank, clean it out and pack that area with OMC triple guard grease. I would buy the tools on this website and check the cable drag (use a fish scale with the cable disconnected at both ends, less than 2.5 lbs both directions full travel). If its more than that, you need a new cable. More work but that's what needs to be done. If its OK, then use Midnight Wolf's tool to set up the cable, then go and adjust the remote cable too. Re-install the drive, and re-do the spin the prop test to check your work. If this is all good, the ESA stumbles the engine when manually tripped, and the idle is not more than 600 it should shift right.

I know this is a lot to absorb, but that's what needs to be done. You can't run it the way it is for sure. So its either find a shop that knows Cobras, or do it yourself.

Author:	orto55 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 9:16 am ]
Post subject:	Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
Well, Took my 245 Vista out for the first time yesterday. Was just meant to be a short trial run to see how she does. Backed her off the trailer and went out to wait for my friend to park the truck and return to the docks where there was a lot of traffic. As Im pulling up to the dock, I put her in reverse to slow the forward momentum, uh oh, no reverse. I quickly turn away yelling at him we have problems and went back out to see if I could figure it out. I called him to let him know what was going on and that I was going to come back in but I needed him to stop the boat as it would no longer go in to neutral as well. As I neared the dock, my friend pushes the bow back out to sea and jump on the swim platform. I looked at him in total shock because I was fully expecting to dock. I started it back up and out we go again. We drove around a little bit giving a little shake down cruise but I was still un able to get it to shift into neutral or reverse. I did notice how ever that when I shut it off and restarted it, it would be in neutral. However, if I turned the steering wheel, it would go back into gear. This really made no sense to me. We ended up anchoring and swimming for a while until the ramp traffic died down. Docked the boat by lassoing a cleat on the dock as we slowly passed by and got the trailer. I really only had one shot at putting her on the trailer as it was getting dark. Was the first time with this big of a boat to trailer and sure enough I stabbed it perfectly. Other than the problem we had, I had a great time. I know there is something wrong with the shift cable but Im not sure where to start. Any suggestions would be grateful.

Author:	taz42169 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 9:32 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
I'd check your shift cable connections on the outdrive. LouC will be of more assistance since it sounds like you have a cobra outdrive.

Author:	LouC [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
Well....I kinda sorta figured...that you'd be posting this...lol... Anyway, been there done that. When I got my '88 H-200 in 2002, it would shift into fwd & rev, but would not shift from rev to neutral, without shutting off the engine. I took it to the best OMC shop around and they basically just removed the drive, cleaned out the crud that builds up behind the bell crank in the pivot housing (the part of the transom mount that the drive bolts on to) and adjusted the cable. It was fine, till about 2013 when the remote cable adjustment changed slightly and then it wouldn't fully engage rev. Most Cobra shift problems are a result of a sticky transom shift cable (needs to be replaced then), crudded up bell crank (easy fix) non functioning ESA (previous owners messing up OMC's nice design trying to make it work like the inferior Merc system) to high idle speed (should be no more than 600 rpm). What to do..... Well you can do a few tests on land first. Get someone up at the helm, to work the remote control for you. Put the drive down and level. With the engine OFF spin the prop while they shift it from neutral to fwd, and neutral to rev. You should feel the prop lock in fully in each gear. If it ratchets then the adjustment of either the transom shift cable, or the remote cable is off. To narrow it down, you can disconnect the transom shift cable at the bell crank on the engine (on your model it should be the lower of the 2 cables on the starboard side, the upper one in the slotted end of the bell crank is the remote cable). Now repeat this test, but shift it with the cable disconnected, and see if it locks in. If it does, then your remote cable adjustment is off. If not then you still have a transom cable/adjustment problem and the drive has to come off. One other thing. If you run it in neutral and try to trigger the ESA (two little switches on the shifter assembly on the engine, the one with the metal lever on it triggers the ESA and should lower the idle). This is what allows the clutch dogs to release, so when you move the shifter to neutral, the fwd or rev gear actually releases and you get neutral. You need this to work because on the water, the force of the water against the prop and the way the gears and clutch dog is made, they will tend to stay engaged. If the ESA does not stumble the idle, then you have to troubleshoot why. If the drive is not shifting fully in to either gear, same thing. Sounds to me like the drive has to come off. Look at this: http://www.midnight-wolf.com/OMC_Instal ... tions.html Some models had the slotted end of the bell crank on the engine facing up, (mine) some had it facing down (earlier ones) pick the one that matches your boat. I know its confusing but read through it several times. I'd pull off the drive and first measure the shift rod height. That has to be right. Then have someone turn the driveshaft clockwise and try to manually shift the drive from neutral to fwd and rev using the shift rod. Look at the prop shaft while you do this. Make sure it is turning the right way in fwd and rev. If it will not shift it has to go to a shop. Next, look at the bell crank in the pivot housing, if its all crudded up behind the bell crank, clean it out and pack that area with OMC triple guard grease. I would buy the tools on this website and check the cable drag (use a fish scale with the cable disconnected at both ends, less than 2.5 lbs both directions full travel). If its more than that, you need a new cable. More work but that's what needs to be done. If its OK, then use Midnight Wolf's tool to set up the cable, then go and adjust the remote cable too. Re-install the drive, and re-do the spin the prop test to check your work. If this is all good, the ESA stumbles the engine when manually tripped, and the idle is not more than 600 it should shift right. I know this is a lot to absorb, but that's what needs to be done. You can't run it the way it is for sure. So its either find a shop that knows Cobras, or do it yourself.

Author:	ric [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:33 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
First shakedown startup and run of a 26 year old boat, at a busy dock, with no self/pro mechanical inspection?? I read stories like those in the newspaper.

Author:	LouC [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:06 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
It could shift well on the water hose on land and then not go to neutral on the water. But a boat this old for sure the whole thing needs to be gone through. Once you get it right then its just the yearly work. That's why I took mine to the pros, since it was too much to learn all at once. Started just winterizing and doing fluid changes and tune ups. Then learned to R+R the drive, then learned to split the upper and lower to clean out the water passage, change the water tube gaskets, last learned to do the shift cable. Its a process....

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Author:	orto55 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
LouC wrote: Well....I kinda sorta figured...that you'd be posting this...lol... Anyway, been there done that. When I got my '88 H-200 in 2002, it would shift into fwd & rev, but would not shift from rev to neutral, without shutting off the engine. I took it to the best OMC shop around and they basically just removed the drive, cleaned out the crud that builds up behind the bell crank in the pivot housing (the part of the transom mount that the drive bolts on to) and adjusted the cable. It was fine, till about 2013 when the remote cable adjustment changed slightly and then it wouldn't fully engage rev. Most Cobra shift problems are a result of a sticky transom shift cable (needs to be replaced then), crudded up bell crank (easy fix) non functioning ESA (previous owners messing up OMC's nice design trying to make it work like the inferior Merc system) to high idle speed (should be no more than 600 rpm). What to do..... Well you can do a few tests on land first. Get someone up at the helm, to work the remote control for you. Put the drive down and level. With the engine OFF spin the prop while they shift it from neutral to fwd, and neutral to rev. You should feel the prop lock in fully in each gear. If it ratchets then the adjustment of either the transom shift cable, or the remote cable is off. To narrow it down, you can disconnect the transom shift cable at the bell crank on the engine (on your model it should be the lower of the 2 cables on the starboard side, the upper one in the slotted end of the bell crank is the remote cable). Now repeat this test, but shift it with the cable disconnected, and see if it locks in. If it does, then your remote cable adjustment is off. If not then you still have a transom cable/adjustment problem and the drive has to come off. One other thing. If you run it in neutral and try to trigger the ESA (two little switches on the shifter assembly on the engine, the one with the metal lever on it triggers the ESA and should lower the idle). This is what allows the clutch dogs to release, so when you move the shifter to neutral, the fwd or rev gear actually releases and you get neutral. You need this to work because on the water, the force of the water against the prop and the way the gears and clutch dog is made, they will tend to stay engaged. If the ESA does not stumble the idle, then you have to troubleshoot why. If the drive is not shifting fully in to either gear, same thing. Sounds to me like the drive has to come off. Look at this: http://www.midnight-wolf.com/OMC_Instal ... tions.html Some models had the slotted end of the bell crank on the engine facing up, (mine) some had it facing down (earlier ones) pick the one that matches your boat. I know its confusing but read through it several times. I'd pull off the drive and first measure the shift rod height. That has to be right. Then have someone turn the driveshaft clockwise and try to manually shift the drive from neutral to fwd and rev using the shift rod. Look at the prop shaft while you do this. Make sure it is turning the right way in fwd and rev. If it will not shift it has to go to a shop. Next, look at the bell crank in the pivot housing, if its all crudded up behind the bell crank, clean it out and pack that area with OMC triple guard grease. I would buy the tools on this website and check the cable drag (use a fish scale with the cable disconnected at both ends, less than 2.5 lbs both directions full travel). If its more than that, you need a new cable. More work but that's what needs to be done. If its OK, then use Midnight Wolf's tool to set up the cable, then go and adjust the remote cable too. Re-install the drive, and re-do the spin the prop test to check your work. If this is all good, the ESA stumbles the engine when manually tripped, and the idle is not more than 600 it should shift right. I know this is a lot to absorb, but that's what needs to be done. You can't run it the way it is for sure. So its either find a shop that knows Cobras, or do it yourself. That's a lot of great information LouC. Thank you very much. Im going to look it over and check out the link you sent me. Looks like im gonna be high and dry for a couple more weeks or longer for sure but this has to be fixed. Thanks again

Author:	orto55 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 2:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
ric wrote: First shakedown startup and run of a 26 year old boat, at a busy dock, with no self/pro mechanical inspection?? I read stories like those in the newspaper. I Know what your saying ric. It was very stupid. But I have been working on it for the past 3 months. I checked that everything worked on land and it did. I did inspect It but apparently not to the degree needed and I luckily learned a lesson with no damage.

Author:	orto55 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
LouC wrote: It could shift well on the water hose on land and then not go to neutral on the water. But a boat this old for sure the whole thing needs to be gone through. Once you get it right then its just the yearly work. That's why I took mine to the pros, since it was too much to learn all at once. Started just winterizing and doing fluid changes and tune ups. Then learned to R+R the drive, then learned to split the upper and lower to clean out the water passage, change the water tube gaskets, last learned to do the shift cable. Its a process.... That was my problem LouC, It did shift like it was suppose to on land with water hose. I had just tested the day before. That is why I was so surprised when it did what it did. Did you catch the part where I mentioned that when I could get it in neutral, If I turned the steering wheel, it would pop back into gear? Didn't matter if I turned it left or right.

Author:	rpengr [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
orto55 wrote: ric wrote: First shakedown startup and run of a 26 year old boat, at a busy dock, with no self/pro mechanical inspection?? I read stories like those in the newspaper. I Know what your saying ric. It was very stupid. But I have been working on it for the past 3 months. I checked that everything worked on land and it did. I did inspect It but apparently not to the degree needed and I luckily learned a lesson with no damage. Don't worry about that comment. Looks like you handled it fine. Sometimes an empty ramp is not an option. ps. I also had a 1987 cobra drive that I was always able to do my own service and adjustments on. I just sold it 2 years ago. It was a great drive, which led me to search for a Volvo Penta on my next boat. I was not as good at the adjustments as LouC, so I am going to defer to his answers.

Author:	orto55 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
quote]Don't worry about that comment. Looks like you handled it fine. Sometimes an empty ramp is not an option. ps. I also had a 1987 cobra drive that I was always able to do my own service and adjustments on. I just sold it 2 years ago. It was a great drive, which led me to search for a Volvo Penta on my next boat. I was not as good at the adjustments as LouC, so I am going to defer to his answers.[/quote] I really should have turned around when I saw how many empty trailers were in the lot. I seriously considered it but I just spent 10 bucks nonrefundable to get in and I really wanted to try it out so I went for. Never had a problem like this with the first three boats I owned so I wasn't expecting to NOT be able to put it in reverse. Was quite the shock actually. LouC told me to thoroughly check everything out, and had given most everything he said a good once over, just not to the degree he was talking about. Didn't even think I knew better than him, just thought that everything seemed fine. Got some work ahead of me to figure it out, but with LouC's help and pointers, I think I can do it. If I cant, will call a shop. Now if I can just get rid of this 100 deg heat I have to work in.

Author:	LouC [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 4:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
OK if turning the wheel (moving the drive from side to side) changes something with the shifting, that suggests that the jacket of the shift cable is cracked, or pulling away from the part where it is attached from the pivot housing. This makes me think you may well need a new cable. If this is the case, I'd only use an OE OMC/BRP cable. You can get the OE parts from any dealer that sells and services Evinrude outboards, or from: www.crowleymarine.com they are a big Merc and OMC parts dealer in Colorado, I've bought stuff from them many times. If you tilt the drive all the way up and look under the pivot housing on the starboard side, you'll see a cable underneath (probably red) and if the casing is cracked, its letting in water and corroding the cable so you get sticky shifting. Take a look at this and it'll start to make sense: http://www.midnight-wolf.com/Cobra_Shif ... nstall.pdf

Author:	orto55 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 5:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
LouC wrote: OK if turning the wheel (moving the drive from side to side) changes something with the shifting, that suggests that the jacket of the shift cable is cracked, or pulling away from the part where it is attached from the pivot housing. This makes me think you may well need a new cable. If this is the case, I'd only use an OE OMC/BRP cable. You can get the OE parts from any dealer that sells and services Evinrude outboards, or from: http://www.crowleymarine.com they are a big Merc and OMC parts dealer in Colorado, I've bought stuff from them many times. If you tilt the drive all the way up and look under the pivot housing on the starboard side, you'll see a cable underneath (probably red) and if the casing is cracked, its letting in water and corroding the cable so you get sticky shifting. Take a look at this and it'll start to make sense: http://www.midnight-wolf.com/Cobra_Shif ... nstall.pdf LouC knocked it out of the park on the last post.

Author:	crossram [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
fw had a problem with the cables on these boats they would do what yours did. i was told to check mine when i bought the boat. . yours looks to be the original cable , by the color. my replacement was red

Author:	rpengr [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
orto55 wrote: The photo shows serious dry rot cracking on your exhaust bellows. Cannot see the shift bellows clearly in the photo (the top one), but it's probably the same age. While it doesn't really matter if the bottom bellows leaks, it matters a lot if the top one does. I would replace them both right away.

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Author:	LouC [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Maiden Voyage, uhg!!
Ray is right, replace those bellows, you have to take the pivot housing off anyway to do the shift cable. Its easy to do the bellows when the pivot is off. Top is the u-joint bellows that is the critical one. The bottom one is the exhaust bellows. Oftentimes people will replace the u-joint bellows but not the exhaust since it is not water tight anyway. The shift cable bellows is actually inside the boat at the top of the tube that the cable goes thru. As I said before, use OE for the shift cable and the ujoint bellows for sure. You can use aftermarket for the exhaust bellows. The shift cable one, take a look at it when you change the cable, they usually longer but check it anyway. The cables, there was a recall on the 86-88 models, the original cables were black, the recall ones were red, the original ones were stretching and not giving full travel so the drives were not going all the way into gear. This was causing them to jump out of gear and the clutch dogs would get rounded off and that would necessitate a lower unit rebuild. If you use an OE cable that is set up right, keep water out of the gear oil and shift it quick (dog clutch drives can grind if you shift slow like a synchromesh transmission) you can easily get 25-30 years out of one of these.