www.iFourWinns.com

So, I am looking for some advice on how to handle a potential problem that came up this past weekend.

I just purchased an '06 Vista 258 this season. Great boat and we love it!! Up until this weekend, it has operated as expected. This past weekend, however, an odd thing happenend. As we pulled out of our norma "sleeping" cove for a morning cruise on Saturday, the boat seemed to really struggle getting up on plane. It was as if the engine's power was not properly transferring to the prop. At this time, it was only me, the admiral and our son. When it happened, I backed of the throttle, let it sit for a second, adjusted the outdrive and trim tabs and tried it again. It seemed to still struggle, but to a lesser extent. I hit the bilge to drain some water, but what came out didn't seem to be enough to affect the performance of the boat. After a few stops and starts, it seemed to work itself out and the boat was planing as expected.

Later in the day my family joined (4 more adults) and the problem resurfaced (so 6 adults and a kid on board). At full throttle, the boat was barely hitting 10 mph and would not get up on plane. Again, I tinkered with it, and it happened intermittently. Sometimes it would get up and go as expected, others it would drag. It definitely seemed as if the outdrive was slipping or missing.

On Sunday, my family left and the problem disappeared. I tried for much of the morning to recreate it, but it didn't happen. So, my questions are:

What could it be?

Is it worth getting checked out?

And, if there turns out to be something wrong, would you go back to the dealer who sold you the boat and at least see if they are willig to kick some money in for the fix?

Appreciate all of your thoughts!

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2006 Vista 258
2007 Yukon Denali

Sounds like the trim tabs arent working properly,
maybe sticking in the up position?

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2008 V288 with twin 5 litre Seacores
http://www.galwayhouse.com.au

It sounds like you got some weeds wrapped around the props possibly. Trim tabs would not cause that slow of a speed at full throttle.

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One of 4 Previous (Sold) Boats:
2000 Four Winns 268 Vista

Current Boat: 2004 Chaparral 235 ssi cuddy

When you say it would reach only 10mph, with full throttle, what engine speed was that ? If ot was only attaining low engine rpm as well, it might be the engine losing power intermittently for some reason. If it really was the outdrive slipping ( cone clutch) or the props spinning on the hubs, with full throttle it would reach high rpm.

Graham

Thanks for the thoughts guys. I'm pretty sure it's not the tabs, because when I was first getting used to the boat I played with them a lot when trying to figure out how to get up on plane quickly. Even with the tabs all the way up, at full throttle with the outdrive trimmed down, the boat would get up and out pretty quick.

As for the RPM question - While I wasn't paying as close of attention as I should have (frustrated and an antsy 4 year old running around), it seemed to stay right around 3,000 - 3,500 RPM even at WOT. I'm no expert on how outdrives operate, but that would suggest to me that it's not slippage. I thought maybe the prop had come unseated, but, again, it's my understanding/experience that this would result in high RPMs.

I got it out of the water and checked for anything tangled on the prop, but there was nothing.

It almost seemed as if the outdrive was "fighting" the engine. When the outdrive was disengaged (neutral), the engine revved and performed as would be expected.

I'm going to go out tomorrow and tinker a bit more, maybe throw some fuel additive in the tank on the thought that it could be fouled up gas.

Keep the thoughts coming!

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2006 Vista 258
2007 Yukon Denali

If your prop was slipping you would have increased RPM with little forward movement, could be a fuel issue check your filters, could have been as stated before junk on the prop. Not real familiar with the duo-prop but what if the outside prop could fall off and you were just left with the larger heavier pitch? If you only had the larger pitch that would make the engine struggle to get you on plane and would act like a real dog.

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2000 268 Vista "Reely Nauti"
http://www.facebook.com/#!/rivercruiser

If it's a duo prop, make sure no-one has swapped your F4 or 5 props for F9's ; Only kidding!

Even in neutral, when the engine is running the input shaft into the outdrive is still turning, as is the upper vertical shaft . So, if something is happening in the outdrive which makes it difficult to turn, it must be lower down. If you turn the prop by hand (engine not running) is it rough/ very difficult to turn ? If not, the problem probably isn't in the outdrive. It doesn't do any harm to check the oil level and drain a little off in case water is getting in past the lower ( propshaft) seals.

Cracked distributor cap allowing moisture in?

Loose/ intermitted coil and ECU connections?

Intermittent Relay failure in the control box ? ( under the plastic engine cover; there are spares there)

I vaguely remember a reference to a check valve at the fuel tank outlet, maybe that's getting blocked intermittently?

is the engine going into safe run mode ( low speed/ reduced power) due to an intermittent faulty sensor ( temperature, oil pressure, knock sensor etc)?

Graham

I am having almost the exact same problem as SundayDinner. Here is my story, maybe we can solve both of our problems.

I have a 2000 248 Vista with a 5.7 GS (not EFI) and a SX Outdrive (Single prop)

This past weekend, I attempted to run the boat with just myself on board, full fuel and gear. Things were fine and I was able to get the motor up to 4800RPM and be on plane in a resnoable amount of time using the tabs and trim.

The next day I loaded the boat with 6 average adults and two small children. I followed the same procedures but was only able to achive 3800 RPM and was never able to get the boat on plane. I wasn't expecting it to jump right up, but I should be able to get on plane with the load.

I have check the drive trim and tabs, all are functioning properly. I switch props from a 15 1/2 x 15 3 blade to a 14 3/4 x 15 4 blade. I had the same problem using both props. The prop spins freely when the motor is off and in netrual. When I replaced the prop, all I did was remove the cotter pin, the nut and washer and replaced in the reverse order.

In summary, with a average load I am able to only get the boat to 3800 RPM but with only one person I can get it to normal range of 4800.

Any thoughts? Don't mean to hijack the thread, but maybe SundayDinner and I are having the same issue?

SundayDinner ..... what prop set do you curently have installed?

ohiolakerat ..... sounds like you just have too much prop, for a loaded boat. Try a prop that is smaller in pitch, not diameter.

For both of you, if the boat is not getting up out of the water (on plane), the engine RPM will not go up past the areas that you've noted .... just too much load on the engine to go any higher. It's producing all the torque it's got. For the RPM to get any higher, the load must be reduced .... ie, getting it up on plane.

I would suggest that both of you experiment with tabs fully down and then move people forward. If this helps, then all seems fine as long as you are on plane (engine power, etc), it would seem that you are simply over-propped for the way the boat is being used.

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Gordon Arnold
New Hampshire

2003 268 Vista ..................................................................Prior: 97 245 Sundowner

I would put money on the prop spinning on the hub. As soon as you put load on the prop it begins to break loose. Pull the props and have your local shop insert new hubs. It doesn't cost a lot and is a quick easy fix. It has happened to me two or three times over the years.

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2008 318 Vista "Ka-wai-ola"
350 MPI/BravoIII DTS Seacore
2006 1500 Key West -70 Yamaha
Previous Boats
Key West 2300CC
Pacemaker 270 Sport Fish
290 Sea Ray

If conditions have changed .... was Ok, now it's not ....... Dave's thoughts may be on target. I have not seen the F-series DP props spin the hubs, but .... certainly could happen.

If the hub is spun, would not the RPM go up though?

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Gordon Arnold
New Hampshire

2003 268 Vista ..................................................................Prior: 97 245 Sundowner

Yes, noticeably.

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One of 4 Previous (Sold) Boats:
2000 Four Winns 268 Vista

Current Boat: 2004 Chaparral 235 ssi cuddy

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

I thought about dropping the pitch of the prop, but I can't find a three blade or 4 blade 15'' diameter prop with less than a 15 pitch. The hub on the 4 blade I tried was brand new, fresh from the box. The original 3 blade i'm not sure but I didn't notice and slip when moving it by hand. Lowering the pitch will only decrease my RPM's right?

I did move people to the front and also tried everything with the tabs. This made somewhat of a difference when there are only 3 people, but with 4 or more this made no difference. I wasn't even turning near the top end of the RPM's.

When I changed the prop, I only had to remove the cotter pin, prop nut and washer. I reassembled the same way in reverse. I've never replaced a prop before. Am I supposed to have a spacer or anything on the "bottom" of the shaft?

I feel like there has to be an easy solution, or that I am missing or doing something wrong. When I picked up the boat and test drove it, the dealer had a hard time getting it out of the water with just two people. Pulled it out and discovered someone put the wrong prop on it. When we changed the prop to the right one (15 1/2 x 15) then things improved. Here I am now with the same 15 1/2 x 15 prop and having problems under load.

I'm not convinced your prop is slipping but the best thing u can do is mark your hub and prop with a line that u can monitor should u suspect it slips.

6 adults is a big load. If they bring a lot of crap and water and fuel are topped off I can easily see this being an issue to get on plane. I can normally get on plane in about 5 seconds if it is just the admiral and I with a full tank. But with 6 adults and especially rough seas I have had to move people inside to the front of the boat to get her to plane.

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Walter

2003 248 Vista - VP 5.0 GXi
2009 Toyota Tundra SR5 5.7L 4x4

In your case, ohiolakerat, I would think you are just over propped.

By reducing your pitch, you will allow the engine to spin up faster and get enough RPM to push the boat up and out of the water. You will be turning a higher rpm.

Reducing your prop pitch is kinda like putting 4.10 gears on a car that is intended for accelleration .... or a heavy car that is only moderately powered .... to get it to perform a bit better.

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Gordon Arnold
New Hampshire

2003 268 Vista ..................................................................Prior: 97 245 Sundowner