www.iFourWinns.com

dropped the boat in today. filled the water tank - turned the pump on to purge the air ... opened the faucets, got the water flowing but pump continued to run for a long time after shutting the faucets. Finally, the pump stopped but water was leaking under the bulkhead beneath the front bed. Not a lot but any amount is too much. This happened once before. Last time the mystery leak disappeared after the system stabilized. I'm wondering if this is some weird atmospheric situation. Don't really know what's going on. Hoping the leak will be gone/done by tomorrow.

Anybody else experience this?

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2006 348 Vista
"some days you're the bug and some days you're the windshield"

My 2000 298 Vista water pump takes about 20 to 30 seconds to stop pumping after all water is shut off but no leaks that I can see. I would hone in on the leak under the front bulkhead (where I believe the pump is from the sound of mine) and forgo the "weird atmospheric situation". Given my boat is 10 years old, I probably need to tighten up a few hose clamps myself.

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Current Boat: 2000 Four Winns 298 Vista
Previous Boat: 2000 Carver 406MY

There's a range of possibilities. The water tank is up under the forward berth. It has two hoses on the top of it, one for filling and the other a vent. There's also a water level sensor in the top of the tank. It's possible to overfill the tank and cause it to bulge a bit. This caused my old water level sensor to leak a bit. Or either of the hoses could have a loose clamp.

The water leaves the tank at the aft center at the bottom. It comes out into a 90 degree fitting, a filter and then a shut-off valve. From there it's up into the starboard bow area and into the freshwater pump. From the pump it continues up and then back along the starboard gunwale (behind the cabinets) to the rest of the boat.

It's possible the fittings from the tank, filter or shut-off have worked loose. Or the lines on the pump.

To check all of this you need to remove the panel on the face of the forward berth. This is the wood panel in which the drawer slides. The wood face is attached to a box for the drawer inside (it's not just the flat face). Pull the drawer out and you'll see two L-brackets inside the top of the drawer cavity. Those hold the panel assembly up to the berth above it. Remove those screws (hint: a right-angle power screwdriver helps here). Then the face of the panel is back-screwed through the fiberglass. That is, there are some screws down along the sides of the panel that hold the panel back against the fiberglass. A shorty Philips screwdriver helps get to these. Bear in mind there are some rough fiberglass surfaces back there, so be prepared for it. Yes, this is a pain-in-the-ass task. There were three down each side in mine. The ones on the bottom were a real stretch to reach. Once you remove the screws the panel, along with drawer box, will come right out. This will open up access to the whole tank and the pump.

If water leaks from the tank it will drain down under the face frame and onto the cabin floor. If the water leaks from the pump it will go down into the center bilge (and not up on the floor).

My guess would be the water line fittings between the tank and the pump.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

So much for tightening up just a couple of clamps. I think I will live with the 20 - 30 seconds of "air" time. Thanks Bill for the detailed version and I hope I never have to go that route.

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Current Boat: 2000 Four Winns 298 Vista
Previous Boat: 2000 Carver 406MY

thanks Bill. Sounds like a huge PITA. I'm hoping the leak will dissipate like it did before but I may have to dive in there.

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2006 348 Vista
"some days you're the bug and some days you're the windshield"

Well, I don't know that it's something you can avoid. Leaks like this don't go away. More likely they just leak in ways you don't quite notice. And given the amount of damage that can be done by long-term water issues (like mold) it's not something I'd feel comfortable ignoring. At the very least try this, remove the drawer and take a look straight down at the bottom edge of the tank. You can just barely get your face in the gap left by removing the drawer. That will let you look down and see the plumbing coming out of the tank. And possibly over to the starboard side to see the pump plumbing. Get a look in there. See what's going on when the pump is running. Also check to see what happens while filling the tank. Let it overfill a little to really see what happens, basically just fill it until water spits out the vent line for a few seconds. That'll put the most amount of (designed in) pressure into the system and will likely reveal any leaks not related to the pump pressure.

And when you have the drawer out you can rest a lit flashlight onto the top of the tank and it will illuminate the water level. It's a handy way to see just how full the tank is.

If you see water dribbling from the fitting on the top of the tank it's the water sensor. Some water level sensors can leak and there's pretty much nothing to be done about it. You just learn to fill the tank less than that amount. Thus the flashlight trick.

As for the 20-30 seconds of startup time, it's likely the system being pressurized. Water doesn't compress, but air does and plastic pipes expand. During that startup time it's likely the pump is putting enough pressure into the lines to compress what little air is left, and also expand the pipes a little bit. Witness that the water will flow for a few seconds before the pump kicks in. I've noticed this lag time decreases as the water gets used more. Some water systems have a pressure canister, but I don't believe ours do (not in the 348 anyway).

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista

In trying to figure out forward bilge water (which I'm still working on), I discovered the factory never put a hose clamp on the vent connection at the water tank.

Thanx for the follow up Bill. Mystery solved! I have 3 sensors on the top of the tank - 2 with plastic caps and one with a glob of sealant. Water was dribbling out of all 3. So the fix is to not fill it full. I was able to get my arm in there (not my fat face) and feel my way along the fittings at the bottom, all of these were dry. I was able to see the water level in the tank with a flashlight. Thankfully I won't have to tear it apart. The pump/pressurization seems to be functioning normally now.

It still seems odd that the sensor fittings leak. But I'm not complaining!

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2006 348 Vista
"some days you're the bug and some days you're the windshield"

I don't know what the hell it takes to make a level sensor that doesn't leak. They all seem to leak. The pressure-fit ones (like yours I'm assuming) as well as the threaded kind. It would seem the only kind that don't are the external ones, which are rather expensive.

You've hit upon the reasonable solution, avoiding filling the tank that far.

Tangentially, this also applies to waste tank issues. Don't let it get full and don't leave it that way.

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-Bill Kearney, 2005 348 Vista