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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 12:10 am 
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Minnow

Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 8:39 pm
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I'm curious what everyone thinks of yamaha jet drive boats? Sounds like they are basically powered by two R1 crotch rocket bike motors. I've heard low speed handling sucks but what are some of the other disadvantages to jet boats? Anyone lined up with one of the newer HO models which I think are rated over 300hp? I'm just curious how fast they are and what people think of them?


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 1:42 am 
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life to the full

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Jet boats seem like a lot of fun, but I am not sure where zooming around burning fuel all of a sudden gets boring. Something to remember is that when you back of the power you lose steering. I would assume that at low speeds their maneuverability would most likely be not so flash. Anyone else feel free to chime in and correct me if necessary. Personally I am partial to my Four Winns for the all round usability.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 6:01 am 
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268 Vista

Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 9:49 am
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Location: West Michigan
bacon1 wrote:
I'm just curious how fast they are and what people think of them?


Why ask a group of Four Winns owners ? :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 7:23 am 
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Now, Now, Cap'n .... your going to get spanked again for that "baditude"

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 7:23 am 
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Location: Lombard, IL
Did not own a yamaha but the jet boat I owned was the biggest mistake of my boating experiences.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 7:38 am 
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All Night Long
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Jet boats are an interesting solution I think if you have kids that want to race around on the water and do some watersports. They have a shallow draft (although have been told they can suck stuff off the bottom of a lake very easily.

Teenagers like to go fast. perfect. Teenagers like to do watersports. perfect. Safety of no propellar when said teenager does something stupid. pefect.

I suppose it's just whatever works. However, if you want a boat to use as a boat and to cruise -- a jet boat is not the solution.

Aren't they significantly louder as well?

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 7:50 am 
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Plus I don't think you have to winterize them if you like to use the boat year round. I have several friends with new Yamaha boats and they love them, but I prefer a good ol' prop for my boat. :D


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 8:43 am 
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Being A Honda CBR954RR Owner I take exception to the "Crotch Rocket Motor" reference :twisted: No they're not an inline 1000cc four stroke eng. Other then that they're basically a large sit in PWC. Yes they do/will suck in stuff if you get too close the to bottom just like PWC's.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 8:53 am 
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Nauti Luv

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:55 am
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Location: Little Elm - Lake Lewisville TX
Like what has already been posted, there are some good and bad...

Good:
1. Shallow draft
2. Dont need to winterize
3. Fast and pretty quick out of the hole
4. No props to get injured on

Bad:
1. Low speed handling is harder to learn and control. You must be moving water through the pump to move.
2. Shallow draft (sucks stuff in if you are not careful)
3. The ones I have seen (other than the Sea-Doos types), seem to sit real high on the trailer for some reason.
4. If you like Captains Call exhaust....forget it.
5. It is a twin engine boat...two motors means twice the potential for problems, twice when you service them etc...

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 9:07 am 
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Don't know the Yamaha product but SeaDoos use small 1.5L Rotax which is a German-design & manufactured product. They are actually used (and originally designed for the light aviation industry). One thing they all have in common is that they are all small displacment / high revving and seem to be running on the edge the whole time. Smaller boats get one engine. Bigger models just get two of the same with maybe a turbo or some such. They are a suprisingly small unit so removal / re-installation would be much simpler than something with a big V8 in the same void.
I had an '06 16' 220hp SuperCharged / Intercooled. I recall I would have to be running in the area of 3k rpm just to get her putting. Wandering off plane was atrocious. In fact off plane there was no straight-ahead only constant correcting and swerving back & forth. I am told this is common for at least the single engine units. Ironically, once you get used to (not hard to do) the reverse power opposite of a prop boat they can be very maneuverable around the dock. They can spin like a top in thier own lenght. In neautral and because of direct drive to the impellar (always turning) they hover in place rather than drift around.
I have never piloted a twin so that may be quite a bit different as far as the wandering issue.
I do not have the luxury of year round boating season so yes, winterizing was required. However with a SuperCharger and Intercooler it was not as simple as it could otherwise be.
Intercoolers (if equipped) are a rad cooled with water inside the intake manifold by the illustrations I have seen - they are basically heat exchangers so I have concerns where the water could go if your IC develops a leak. Into the cylinders perhaps? Eeek. Speaking of which ask about flushing. Even with closed loop you had to flush for the exhaust cooling etc. With a SeaDoo NEVER have flush water running without the engine running. It can (has on some models) backed up into the cylinders. ByeBye crank, connecting rods and pins, valves etc.
Yes, they have rediculous holeshot and accelleration.
In at least the SeaDoo product line (I suspect the others as well) they have the option of providing a second user a learners key which limits the RPM and does something to the ignition timing thus dramatically kills the power - a very nice feature if you are permitting your kids to use it and have some doubts in thier responsability. They will get on plane and maybe a bit faster but not a whole lot more than that.
My gripe is in the cost of maintenance (fuel useage I felt was quite reasonable in a single) and the spartan accommadions (relative to prop boats) for the dollar. SuperCharger for mine would be a $2500 -3000 repair and I understand they could be easily blown if the boat came out of the water (such as jumping waves and with shallow V (?) in the hull this is easy and sometimes unavoidable). I have my suspicions on the expected lifespan of an engine run on and off 10-12k rpm all the time. Also be aware that 220Hp in a jet drive is not the same as 220hp in a prop boat. Common belief is that you lose +/- 20% of your HP from a prop to a jet but then the jet boats can be lighter.
The shallow draft is a bit of a farce in a sense. Up side you will pass over a submerged boulder on plane if it is only several inches under water. Very cool and very true. But be carefull in assuming that means you only need a couple of feet of water to run 'em. Dealer warned me - "punch it in shallow water and you willl suck a rock the size of a grapefruit off the bottom". Not a big problem - it won't go through the intake. But all the little stones around it will so kiss your impellar, wear ring and possibly your jet pump goodbye. You are then in the same position as replacing an outdrive but without the worry at least of a totaled transom like some other poor bugger here is now going through.
I have heard concerns of weeds causing problems and there are a fair amount growing on my ramp. Never had an issue with that. A rope can really ruin your day but I guess it can on a prop boat as well. Just more of a risk - it's almost gauranteed to cost you a wear ring at the least if a rope goes in your jet - could go either way with a prop. Its also very unlikely you can limp home if a rope or some such goes in your jet unless you are running a twin.
Goods and bads - just like everything else. I came to a FW because I wanted a bigger & more comfortable boat and refused to go to a twin for the sake of a 20 something footer. Double the maintenance, double the heartache AFAIAC. If I am going through the headache of a twin, well I want a Vista out of the deal :wink:
Check to see about insurance as well. It was tough where I live and I had only one option and rock or object ingestion to the jet pump was a difficult claim to make as I recall.
The Yamaha looks like a real nice product as Jet Drives go. Accommodations are nicer than SeaDoo at least. You just have to do as I did - consider all the pros & cons and pick what suits your lifestyle & budget best. Mine brought me to FW but make no mistake a jet is a total blast (also).
As for top speed I was told that it is a "gentlemans agreement" in the jet industry that they are intended for family use and despite continued increases in HP they will top out in the neighborhood of 60. They just keep increasing the accelleration (just as dangerous in my mind).

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Last edited by Blessed on Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:41 am, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 9:24 am 
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230 Mike
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Cap'n Morgan wrote:

Why ask a group of Four Winns owners ? :roll:


I was wondering the same thing.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 9:41 am 
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268 Vista

Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 9:49 am
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Location: West Michigan
Thanks Mike. I was not trying to be mean, just strange for a first post to choose this particular board to ask the question. But , he/she did get some good feedback.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 10:07 am 
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Cap'n Morgan wrote:
Thanks Mike. I was not trying to be mean, just strange for a first post to choose this particular board to ask the question. But , he/she did get some good feedback.


I was just poking some fun at you Cap'n.... Hopefully no offense was taken.

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'98 H200, 5.0 GL w/VP SX drive


Last edited by millhaven_nice_guy on Fri Jul 31, 2009 10:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 10:11 am 
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Also when I was making the deal to buy our FW they also sell Yamaha's & Jim the sales person told me that the Yamaha's are NO comparison to the FW's boat. He sells both so that was his $0.02 FWITW :?:

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:15 am 
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They suck for water sports. Nothing in the water to hold the back end.

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