Smooth new VP engine's

NiagaraChillin · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 12:29 pm

Somedays I'm glad my old boat has a 302. This is one of those days... :lol:

ric · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 12:57 pm

You sir are very confused. They're all Generation IV designs. The LY6 is in the VORTEC engine family, not an LS family line. Since the LS and Vortec familes share the same common Gen IV block design many parts do and will cross-reference but LY6 heads and blocks are not the same what you'll find in a LS. The closest sister engine to an LY6 is the LS3. They are similar yes, but not spec for spec the same. The LY6 uses L92 Vortec heads which are LS3 "Style" heads (same base cast) but the port design, airflow, and all valvetrain components are 100% different specs.

An LS3/L92 engine also uses an aluminum block. The LY6 is cast iron.

The fuel, intake, ignition system is 100% different.

There is only one spec in the books that an LY6 shares in common with it's sister LS3 engine: The stroke length. Even the bore size is different. Every other spec is different. Build materials are different. They are nothing alike.

So you can have hopes and dreams all you want but the LY6 is a Vortec engine, not an LS engine. It has nothing in common with the Corvette engine except the block and heads share the same bolt patterns.

If you want a psudo "LS" engine you can buy LS3 heads, LS3 cam, LS3 intake, LS3 fuel system, bore it out more MM and fit LS3 pistons/rods/crank... but you still have a cast iron LY6 with some bolt ons. It wouldn't be considered an LS3 unless you used the LS3 aluminum block... but at that point there is nothing left of the original LY6 engine.....and you really just purchased an LS3 part by part.

RedRocketSS · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 2:00 pm

Ric, spend some time reading/searching on LS1tech and other performance based forums. You will clearly see that the term "LS" can be related to ANY GEN III/IV motor. Regardless of the block material, heads, etc. My LQ4 is an iron block, the LS1 it replaced is an aluminum block. Does that mean I don't have an "LS" motor in my car? Is the 5.3 in my Avalanche not "LS" based since it's an iron block? But, but, it's a Vortec 5300 motor. Who cares! I can take a LS1 cam and put it in there. I can take a LS1 intake and slap it on there. I can take the heads from my 5.3 and put them on an LS1 and vice-versa.

The ignition systems are slightly different. Still both coil over plug. Coils can be interchanged if wanted from trucks to cars. In fact, I will be running truck coils on my car. The only difference is the reluctor wheel and cam sensor being different from GEN III to GEN IV motors. Big deal, that can be changed over.

My whole point is that you are failing to realize that any GEN III/IV motor is "LS based". The vortec crap means nothing. L92 heads are L92 heads. LS3 heads are the same casting, only using different valves and springs.

I have been messing with these motors for quite some time. Have done tons of research, have friends in the LS Performance business world, etc. I am not going to argue with someone who has no knowledge (other than what they read online) of these motors.

I can see, as an outsider looking in, that one could say they are not an LS engine since they do not have LS in their name, have different block materials, different intakes, etc. However, they ALL share so many similarities, and are ALL based of which motor? The LS1.

Once again, the BROAD term for ANY GEN III/IV motor is............LS.

Forgot to add this quote from the Chevy 5.3 Towing thread...

"This is just me talking, but if I was in the market for a new tow vehicle I can't even fathom wasting it on ancient technology. That 5.3 engine is just a 305 from the 70's with a little bit of kit added on to it."

That right there tells me you know nothing about the "LS" family of engines.

Sorry about your thread Cap'n!

ric · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 2:19 pm

No. The the broad term is not "LS" for any gen 4 motor. Maybe for the special ed kids that put round pegs in square holes or put those trailer hitch "balls" on their truck telling their fellow redneck buddies they got a 'vette motor in their pickup. You don't. The Vortec truck engines and LS performance engines share nothing in common with eachother. Absolutely nothing except the same rough casting molds of the heads and block before they were machined. That's where their similarities end. Absolutely nothing is the same between them otherwise.

Pretend you're at the bar playing one of those "spot the differences" video games.

This is an LS3 engine:

This is an LY6 engine:

RedRocketSS · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:04 pm

You are a complete moron. You post a picture of motors with all the plastic coverings and whatnot on them. Pull all that off, pull the accessories off, and what do you have? You must not be reading anything I have posted about the similarities.

Explain how I took an LQ4 iron block "Vortec" motor, swapped over all of my accessories from my LS1, put in an LS based cam, LS6 intake on it, used my LS1 fuel rails, etc., and make it work in my car? How about all the other people who have swapped LM7, L33, LQ4, LQ9, L76, LY6, etc. motors into LS cars and make them work?

I cannot believe you don't understand where I am coming from. Well actually I can. I have seen it enough on this site from you. Thinking you know damn near everything.

http://www.superchevy.com/technical/eng ... ewall.html

Specifically sates "Building Gen III and Gen IV (alias LS)..."

Go to LS1tech.com and read through threads.

How many Gen III/IV motors have you tore down? How many have you modified? I would safely bet ZERO. I am done arguing with you about this. This is one topic you are outmatched at, and you don't have the answers.

The 6.2L L92 in trucks is damn near the same thing as the 6.2L L99 in the Auto Camaro. The LS3 is also a 6.2L, doesn't have valve reliefs in the pistons, no active fuel management, and a lower lift cam due to the AFM.

There goes your Vortec motor vs. Performance motor theory.

Once again...ALL GEN III/IV CHEVY MOTORS ARE LS BASED and LS is the broad term for them.

Get a clue and stop posting useless crap. You are outgunned and have no clue what you are talking about.

ric · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:27 pm

The blocks/head share the same bolt hole placement. That's it buddy. Everything else on the engines are engineered to different sizes/specifications/out of different materials. I guess if that means they're the same you should be working for the government. Don't ever get a job as a scientist or work in the healthcare field for the sake of humanity.

In your eyes that also means that my house cat is also a Bengal Tiger! Heck yeah! Take them off the endangered species list!! They're exactly the same... they're both cats.

ric · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:34 pm

Were you the person that restored that famous Jesus painting in Spain? Looks identical.

beyond the blue · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:05 pm

Please forgive me, as I say in jest but "Jesus I'll bet you two are a "wow" at parties"

RedRocketSS · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:16 pm

You are just so full of infinite wisdom. You haven't acknowledged anything I have proven.

Where are you getting that I said they are exactly the same? I said they are referred to as LS motors, which they are. Parts are interchangeable between the motors. The first production GEN III motor was the LS1. Thus all GEN III/IV are referred to as LS based.

So the L99 in the Auto Camaro isn't an LS based motor, but the LS3 in the manual cars is? Are you clueless? I pointed out the differences already. It's derived from the LS3 but it's not an LS motor? Explain that to the GM Engineers who developed the motors.

I guess all the LS speed shops around the world are wrong too huh? Editors and writers for every GM magazine is wrong too right? Get off your high horse and get a clue.

You are obviously failing to see what I have been saying. Never once did I say they are the SAME. I obviously know the differences of the motors, what parts can be swapped to different motors, etc. I have BUILT them, MODDED them, SWAPPED them, etc. What have you done other than try to take shots at me by posting ridiculous remarks and meaningless pictures? You are the one who thought the 5.3 was a 305 with 70's technology and a "kit" to up the power. Seriously dude? WTF is a "kit"? You haven't a clue what the motors are referred to outside your little know it all box.

I hate linking to Wikipedia articles, but read the first sentence Mr. Know-it-all. The Super Chevy article should have been enough for you to get the picture though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_LS_engine

Until you actually work on, build, or even own a LS motor, get out of here.

You aren't going to change my mind, nor tons of other people's, shops, magazines, etc. on what they are referred to.

RedRocketSS · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:18 pm

beyond the blue wrote:

Please forgive me, as I say in jest but "Jesus I'll bet you two are a "wow" at parties"

Insightful post. Thanks.

ric · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:47 pm

I can't seem to find any LS based engines that have similar specs to a LY6 that it could be based off from. I've looked at LS1, LS2, LS3, LS4, LS6, LS9, and the LSA. Am I missing something? First off none of them are cast iron blocks. Nothing matches the bore/stroke. Nothing matches the cam profile. Nothing matches the heads. It doesn't have any of it's intake/fuel/ignition/ecu system parts from any of those LS engines. None of the accessories are the same. The only engine that comes close in spec is the LS3 that shared it's rough cast heads before milling and assembly. Due to that sharing of common head molds it allows tuners to use the LS3 heads and intake/fuel system since the bolts line up. That's it.

So please enlighten me how it's "based" upon a series of engines it has absolutely nothing in common with except they all have 8 pistons.

RedRocketSS · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2012 5:09 pm

The LS2, LQ4, LQ9, and LY6 all have the same bore and stroke, 4.000 X 3.622. Who cares if the block material is different? You are trying to say that truck motors are completely different than the Performance car motors. I have pointed you to various articles, and FACTS, that prove they are not as you put it, "completely different". If they are all not LS based, then how can I bolt any GEN III head to an LS1 motor, or water pump, or alt with the correct brackets, or power steering pump, etc., etc. Why would I be able to bolt a LS3 intake onto a LY6?

Just because the motor ID name doesn't start with LS, does not mean it is not "LS Based". Once again, why would they all share the same cam, intake, accessories? You realize they are in different platforms so they change things up to tailor to that platform right? Get it yet?

I still don't see how you could have read anything in this article.

http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/tech/ ... ewall.html

It groups the LS3, L99, and L92 all in the same paragraph! The L92 is a truck motor though right? How can that be? Oh yea, they are all derived from the LS3!!!

The term LS is used loosely like I have mentioned. Any GEN III/IV has, and always will be, referred to as an LS based motor. End of story.

gerard76 · **Posted:** Fri Sep 07, 2012 7:14 am

I think what ric is failing to see and that RedRocketSS is trying to explain is that the LS series engines are a "family" of engines and as such are related and Ric you are trying to make the LY6 and LS3 identical twins instead of just brothers or cousins.

The term LS is generic like Rocket said and applies to many different engines. It is like saying a Chevelle is not a Chevy because it doesn't look exactly like a Camaro! They are both part of the same lineage.

RedRocketSS · **Posted:** Fri Sep 07, 2012 8:31 am

gerard76 wrote:

I think what ric is failing to see and that RedRocketSS is trying to explain is that the LS series engines are a "family" of engines and as such are related and Ric you are trying to make the LY6 and LS3 identical twins instead of just brothers or cousins.

The term LS is generic like Rocket said and applies to many different engines. It is like saying a Chevelle is not a Chevy because it doesn't look exactly like a Camaro! They are both part of the same lineage.

Thank you Gerard. I assume since Ric hasn't posted back in here I must have got through to him. I think one would realize it's quite obvious I know my LS lineage! Haha.

ric · **Posted:** Fri Sep 07, 2012 8:43 am

No, I'd rather just let you sound stupid to whomever you talk to about the subject. That's more satisfying then arguing over the internet.

www.iFourWinns.com

Smooth new VP engine's

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