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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 9:50 am 
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Goldfish

Joined: Mon May 11, 2009 9:33 am
Posts: 35
Location: High Point, NC
I finally burned thru half a tank of the gas that was topped off last fall before we winterized it. (with a 10 month old on board we spend more time anchored than running around) Yesterday morning before heading out to the lake I stopped by our usual gas station and put in 20 gallons and filled up my truck along with it. When I got to the launch and put the boat in the water, my wife couldn't get the engine started. I got the sense that the engine may be starving for fuel so I gave it a little gas and it fired right up and ran just fine. We stopped in a cove to do a little swimming for an hour or so and when we pulled up anchor it started right up. We then went on to another location when our friends showed up with their boat and we dropped anchor for 3 or so hours. When I went to fire up the boat to head back it wouldn't start again until i gave it some gas (my engine is fuel injected). The fuel filter is new and the only thing that has changed was the added fuel, otherwise it runs great. Could I have stirred up some water or sediment (even though my fuel was treated in the fall) in the bottom of my tank (the other 20 gallons) that would cause a problem like this? There's no issue with the new gas in my truck, which was done from the same pump at the same time.

Does anyone have any advice besides changing the fuel filter and before having to dump 40 gallons of fuel? I appreciate your replies.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 1:15 pm 
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Villiage Idiot

Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:28 pm
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Location: Kansas City
I think you're on track... likely just stirred up some water. I wouldn't do the filter just yet, unless it seems starved for fuel at high RPM/load. Try Stabil, or similar products and a full tank of gas first and see how she does. The GF loves that I do some hard cornering at high speed to make sure everything is mixed well :wink:

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 2:55 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2008 7:13 pm
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Location: Allatoona Lake, Georgia
Sounds like water to me too. My marina went to ethanol last year and I am working on my 3rd set of fuel filters this season. They have had so many complaints about water in fuel problems that they paid extra to get real gas this year.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 3:25 pm 
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Goldfish

Joined: Mon May 11, 2009 9:33 am
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Location: High Point, NC
I think this gas station uses ethanol as well and got me thinking. Is it best to start with stabilizer before changing the fuel filter and go from there? or would you recommend changing the filter as well? If it is indeed water (and hopefully not "much") can I save the tank with stabilizer?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 3:32 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2008 7:13 pm
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Location: Allatoona Lake, Georgia
fbusse wrote:
I think this gas station uses ethanol as well and got me thinking. Is it best to start with stabilizer before changing the fuel filter and go from there? or would you recommend changing the filter as well? If it is indeed water (and hopefully not "much") can I save the tank with stabilizer?


There are so many conflicting recommendations on how to handle this fuel but if you can avoid leaving any in your tanks at the end of the season, that is what I recommend. That crap has no shelf life at all and I got burned bad. As for me, I just poured in another 6 bottles of SeaFoam in my two tanks hoping to save the 1/2 tank of gas I have in there now. Hopefully, a few of the knowlegeable boaters will chime in because I am at a loss myself.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 4:02 pm 
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Villiage Idiot

Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:28 pm
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Location: Kansas City
My state (Mo) switched over to E-10 about the time I bought my boat and haven't had any issues. As part of pre-winterization, the last tank of the season gets a treatment of Stabil before a final run, then topped off and parked in the drive. I have never had issues, but top off after every other weekend to ensure there is little air volume for condensation. As far as shelf life, I have also not noticed performance degradation on either my FW or the last boat. I am only now on my second tank for this year!

My suggestion..... Try the Stabil (or what ever you prefer). If after about 2 tanks it hasn't cleared, replace the filter. This doesn't sound like a fuel-starvation issue though. However, I get mine changed at the end of each year anyway!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 4:07 pm 
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230 Mike
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I add StaBil in the correct proportion every time I add gas. :wink:

But, if you've got enough water in there to cause those symptoms, I'm not sure StaBil will help much.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:17 pm 
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Dolphin

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:42 pm
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Location: merrill, wi
i've done a little research on ethenol, it's kinda bad stuff for boats. really bad for older boats. i won't use it

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:52 pm 
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Narwhal
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Location: Chicago, IL
Now that I've found a nearby gas station that sells non-ethanol gas I've sworn off using ethanol in the boat. If I were in your shoes I'd follow the recommendations above for adding Stabil, but make certain you use the marine Stabil product - I've read that it bonds the water molecules into the ethanol 'enhanced' fuel better, preventing separation. Costs nearly twice as much, but could save you 40G of gas.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 2:01 pm 
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Goldfish

Joined: Mon May 11, 2009 9:33 am
Posts: 35
Location: High Point, NC
I finally got to use my boat after a month and a half (plans, baby, weather, etc...). I put in a full bottle of marine grade sta-bil shortly after I started having issues and it sat for 5 weeks. It had trouble starting and after giving it a little gas it came to life. After running it for a few minutes I shut it off, waited a few moments, and turned the key. It fired right back up and ran great the rest of the day. Thanks for the advice and it's always nice when it's an easy fix.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:37 pm 
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Interesting to note that we here in suburban New York (Long Island) went through the ethanol problems about 5 years ago so we have had some experience with it. And let me say first that I'm ticked off because we get NO benefit from it...at least in the Midwest it benefits farmers but here it's nothing but another example of the gov't forcing things down people's throats and not listening to experts, but rather big business. Yes unlike some parts of the midwest that benefit from ethanol, we are FORCED to use it...

OK now that's out of the way, here are the facts:
1) Save your money on additives, if you have water in the gas, there is no point adding more alcohol based additives to run it through the engine. The problem is, ethanol does 2 bad things. One it cleans the tank if dirty (not bad in itself) but does it all at once and clogs filters (bad). Then it attracts moisture in the air. Your boat fuel tank is vented to the atmosphere like your cars were in the old days. The ethanol will actually pull moisure out of the air. The gas/ethanol mixture can hold a set amount of water till it phase separates. Then the water will drop to the bottom of the tank, with the ethanol, and leave you with low octane gas on top. NONE, I repeat, NONE of the additives will prevent or reverse phase separation, period. All stabil is good for is keeping the fuel from oxidizing so it burns well the next season.

2. So if you have water in your gas, the only things that work are getting it out, and keeping it out. You can switch to the Racor filter with the metal bowl for inboards and drain the fuel to check for water, and keep doing this till you don't see it any more. If you have a lot you should get the tank pumped.

3. Keep in mind that Big Agri-Business wants to have E-15 and E-20 next because they are not making enough on E-10. When that happens (and it will, because no one in the gov't listens to experts who know more than they do), every boat owner, every small engine operator will be out of luck with warrantee repairs because using anything more than E-10 violates any boat engine or small engine warrantee...yes that's true read the fine print...

Make sure you use a good water separating filter, rated for 10 microns, Racor preferred, and make sure you gas cap gasket does not let water in, that's the most you can do. Forget depending on Stabil or Seafoam, they will work for what they were designed, but not for water in the gas because of ethanol.....

And this is just for I/Os, ethanol does nasty things to those nice expensive Yamaha 4 stroke outboards that most new boats here have (clogs up the VST filters) and old boats with fiberglass gas tanks have a whole nother problem (the ethanol dissolves the 'glass resins and makes a sticky mess that ruins the engine and can cause the tank to leak. Big business manipulation of gov't is clearly a BAD thing, and not getting any better....

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:47 pm 
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Goldfish

Joined: Mon May 11, 2009 9:33 am
Posts: 35
Location: High Point, NC
If you look at the original post, the problem wasn't with water in the gas (necessarily). It was that the engine wouldn't start 30 minutes after I put 20 gallons of gas in it (up to 10% ethanol, or so they say). I clearly didn't read the neat little sticker they put on the pump. I'll fill up at the marina next time and save myself the headache.

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