There was a lot of people having a bad day yesterday.

ric · **Posted:** Tue Jul 26, 2011 3:58 pm

E10 in airplanes has nothing to do with water. E10 is an unleaded automotive gas. Aircraft engines need leaded fuel to run properly and the lead keeps parts more reliable, it also doesn't vapor lock at high altitudes like car gas. AVgas is made with much stricter quality controls then mogas too. You might as well be comparing ethanol to methanol. They are nothing alike. There is no benefit or reason to mix ethanol to aviation fuel. There is however, many beneficial reasons to add it to automotive/marine fuel. It's nobody's fault but yours if you only use your boat once a month and the fuel separates or gums up your carb. Gasoline of any blend has a shelf life, and generally if you're using gas that's over a month old you're taking a gamble especially in an open to air container like a boat gas tank.

Take care of your boat, and it will take care of you. It has nothing to do with the type of gas you're putting in it. Running E10 in a boat is safer then E0. Running E85 would be even more ideal. It's safer for you (less carbon monoxide) and less bad stuff in the water for the marine life.

298VISTA2000 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:44 pm

ric wrote:

It's nobody's fault but yours if you only use your boat once a month and the fuel separates or gums up your carb.

And therein lies the problem with ethanol. The vast majority of people are never going to use their boats enough to keep ethanol from breaking down and absorbing massive amounts of water. I don't have a problem with running ethanol in my cars because I know I am going to burn that crap out before it can do any damage but I may not use my boat for up to a month at times. Case in point: I just went on vacation for two weeks straight and that kept me from boating for 4 weeks because I have to work during the week and can only boat on the weekends. All I know is that our yacht club tried ethanol for 1 year and had so many complaints from the members that they went back to regular gas the next season. Could it be that the majority of the members are elderly and have large boats and they don't take them out every week if even once a month? Without a doubt and there is nothing wrong with that except when you have ethanol in your tanks.

wkearney99 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 26, 2011 6:34 pm

It is just entirely untrue that E-10 is going to be so unstable as to be unable to last for a month. Utterly false. Hell, I had half tank's worth left over from last August (50 gallons each in two tanks) and topped off to full (220 total) in October. Fired up the boat in APRIL and it still ran fine. Absolutely nothing wrong. I have water separators installed and have seen no water accumulate in them. So much for rampant water accumulation issues, and it's humid as all get out around here.

If you've got a fuel system that's allowing such an extreme amount of air into the tanks that it causes THAT much condensation then you have much bigger problems. Problems that would exist whether ethanol was added or not.

So, really, enough with the hysteria and outright falsehoods.

sachem29 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 26, 2011 8:30 pm

Quote:

E10 in airplanes has nothing to do with water. E10 is an unleaded automotive gas. Aircraft engines need leaded fuel to run properly and the lead keeps parts more reliable, it also doesn't vapor lock at high altitudes like car gas

First of all most automotive fuels have a "much" lower octane rating than avgas which is 100LL/low lead. Aircraft engines
require a higher octane to prevent detonation/pinging due to higher performance engines.

Concerning vapor lock the only way to get this situation in an aircraft is on the ground on a very hot day with very little airflow over the engine not at altitude.

You cannot use ethanol fuels in an aircraft/non expreimental class is because water has everything to do w it. Most, not all
piston powered aircraft are "older" carburated engines that fuel runs through a venturi type carburator and is highly succeptable to
freezing, especially at altitude, this is why a/c are equiped w carb heat.

ric · **Posted:** Tue Jul 26, 2011 9:06 pm

Mogas can bubble at low pressures that causes vapor lock, not from heat like on a car driving through a desert.

LouC · **Posted:** Tue Jul 26, 2011 9:06 pm

You cannot use ethanol fuels in an aircraft/non expreimental class is because water has everything to do w it.
Most, not all
piston powered aircraft are "older" carburated engines that fuel runs through a venturi type carburator and is highly succeptable to
freezing, especially at altitude, this is why a/c are equiped w carb heat.

this is the point that I was trying to make, water in the fuel, which is exacerbated by alcohol content, causes problems in both boats and aircraft, in aircraft, carb icing, in boats, water in the carb. Yes I will say that, if everything goes right, the E-10 is really E-10 and not E-15 or 20, the deck fill seals well, the vent does not let in water, then you can use E-10 without trouble. But in the real world, everything does not always go right. So to all of you forced to use E-10, make sure your deck fill gasket is in good shape, make sure your vent does not let in water and replace the fuel filters at least once a season. I have had E-10 sit in my tank for 6 months and the engine does start up fine in spring. But I buy from a fuel dock with a good rep, not just any station, and am fussy about maintenance.

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There was a lot of people having a bad day yesterday.

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